1st Presidential Debate

Lord Blazer · 09-27-2008, 05:25 AM

Wow. I hate to say it, but in the end it looks like the debate came out really even. I blame this mostly on the fact that every 20 seconds McCain would cut Obama off with some inane "Maverick this Obama did that or in my 26 years" while Obama was a polite gentleman and kinda waited for McCain to finish a lot. While this is an admirable trait, it's not really appropriate for a debate like that.

The entire thing still felt a lot like McCain's approach has been thusfar, which has been 50% MAVERICK and 50% Obama bad but 0% this is what I'll do.

Thoughts? I should not start political threads.

Shaun · 09-27-2008, 05:28 AM

did they plan the presidential debate for a Friday because they knew I would get drunk and miss it? I wanted to watch it.. god damn it. Who the hell's gonna watch it on a Friday night? God damn it

Aaron Haynes · 09-27-2008, 05:37 AM

McCain had this ugly sneer/smirk on his face every time Obama talked, like he didn't think he deserved to be on the same stage as the big boys.

Obama was on defense a lot -- I think he was surprised by just how aggressively McCain spun out distortions and mischaracterizations, and repeatedly felt like he had to defend his record, which takes away precious time and audience focus. He fought back effectively, and with the exception of earmarks, which went on way too fucking long, he managed to keep the debate from being framed on McCain's terms. Unfortunately, that meant that he wasn't able to frame much on his own terms (especially with McCain sneering and scoffing at him the whole damn time).

Obama looked magnanimous and presidential. McCain looked like a smirking, condescending asshole. It's hard to say who "won"; obviously Obama had the facts on his side and I agree with his policies more, but McCain did a good job of distracting.

(Shaun: I'm sure it'll be available online at some point. They're replaying it on MSNBC at 4pm tomorrow, and I'm sure it'll re-air a bunch more times.)

Andres · 09-27-2008, 06:04 AM

Obama has the right arguments, he just doesn't know how to be forceful.

His argument regarding how McCain makes a ridiculous deal about earmarks when they in no way cover up for his tax cuts is a good argument, but he is not forceful about it. Comes across half-assed. He has similar issues with other points. He is too respectul.

Besides that, there are obvious things that politically you cannot say in America, but it's still sad to see the argument fall into that. In particular I am talking about these idiotic discussions about "nuclear iran" and these two guys trying to beat each other at the task of sucking on Israel's cock.

Orcus · 09-27-2008, 06:09 AM

They should test to see if McCain can pronounce 'Ahmadinejad' before he can actually beginning discussions on how to deal with Iran.

Breed · 09-27-2008, 06:10 AM

That fucking smile on McCain drove me goddamn crazy

Rabid Dinosaur · 09-27-2008, 06:39 AM

I watched this. McCain only made me say stuff to the TV a couple times.

Aaron Haynes · 09-27-2008, 06:42 AM

McCain got the last word on a lot of things just from interrupting and oversimplifying Obama's positions at the end of a few of those five-minute back-and-forth segments. Particularly the one on negotiating with Iran.

SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS WE'LL JUST DISAGREE WITH AHMADINAMAJIDIANIAAD? HOW NAIVE. Most of what he did tonight was construct strawmen.

Kunio · 09-27-2008, 10:36 AM

to be fair if Obama was more forceful on calling him out the people would see him as a scary angry black man and a black man having opinions scares the people while a mummy threatening 3 countries at once is all cool Götterdämmämerica

Bobby Swisha · 09-27-2008, 02:32 PM

Yeah pretty much whatever everyone else said. It surprised me just how much the two candidates hate each other, I thought they'd be more respectful of each other but I guess I was wrong.
Why did the moderator let McCain talk and interrupt so damn much? They should have just cut him off.

Lord Blazer · 09-27-2008, 03:18 PM

There was one point where Obama said something about McCain or brought up a good point or something I don't quite recall, pretty early on, and McCain just looked SUPER FUCKING PISSED oh my god.

And those who watched it on CNN: What the fuck was the point of the audience reaction meter thing?

Bobby Swisha · 09-27-2008, 03:47 PM

McCain really looked like he didn't want to share the stage with a black person. And Obama just looked like he was thinking "that motherfucker!!" the whole time.

I liked how neither of them could answer the moderator on the economy and just kept talking about social programs/shitty tax breaks instead and he was just really frustrated by their stupid answers.

Pogo · 09-27-2008, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conservapedia

In the debate, Barack Obama repeatedly used the Muslim pronunciation of "Pakistan": "Pokiston".

Thank God that SOMEONE out there is focusing on the issues that MATTER

Shaun · 09-27-2008, 06:18 PM

What do they think he's gonna do when he gets into office? Assist terrorists in building a nuke, then flee the country?

Space Goat · 09-27-2008, 06:22 PM

I was amused at how McCain repeatedly argued that "even Obama conceded the surge was a success" and "Obama still to this day refuses to acknowledge the surge worked" in the same breath.

Allergic 2 Life · 09-27-2008, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun

did they plan the presidential debate for a Friday because they knew I would get drunk and miss it? I wanted to watch it.. god damn it. Who the hell's gonna watch it on a Friday night? God damn it

Orcus · 09-27-2008, 06:25 PM

Any variation of Ahmadinejad that is not really Ahmadinejad should be on there too.

Kunio · 09-27-2008, 06:45 PM

You do realize that if that rule was there you'd be pretty much drinking all the time correct

Air Rick · 09-29-2008, 02:31 PM

you guys more or less put it more eloquently, but I watched it on a channel that mostly had the split-screen between the two, instead of focusing on one more that the other.

But McCain looked like a dick. Really. He wouldn't even *look* at Obama, and even though Obama would say stuff like "McCain is absolutely right, and actually agree with McCain," McCain had nothing nice to say back, and instead attempted to make Obama look like a tool. So, of course, Obama spent a lot of time on the defensive...

A horrible demeanor when debating if you ask me.

The Chinese Jew · 09-29-2008, 06:12 PM

Interesting column by Roger Ebert on the debate:

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/...TARY/809289997

I didn't see the debate, but the two things I heard about from quite a few people was how Obama said numerous times, "John Mccain is right when he says this..." and how Mccain just wouldn't look at Obama at all when he talked. Though, that could be a lack of confidence. I heard that during the Bush vs. Clinton debates, Bush was looking at his watch when talking.

Air Rick · 09-29-2008, 06:58 PM

that's actually a very good article. Sums up what I wanted to say pretty nicely.

"Contemptuous behavior" is definitely what I'd call it...

Bob Toasted · 09-29-2008, 11:33 PM

My favorite part was when Jim Leher had to repeat the purpose of the question over and over and ended up yelling at the two. It was like being in high school and no one did their homework.

Aaron Haynes · 09-29-2008, 11:49 PM

Hahaha, yeah. He was trying to get them to specify which of their proposed programs they'd have to cut from the budget due to the economy shitting right through its pants. Certainly Obama wouldn't be willing to say, as it'd be a tacit admission that that particular subject isn't going to get any work done on it during his first term. If he said his health care proposal would be delayed, there'd be an attack ad put out by the McCain campaign before the debate was even over.

Notch Johnson · 09-29-2008, 11:49 PM

oh god i cant wait.

Bob Toasted · 09-30-2008, 12:29 AM

Oh god. She better have something up her sleeve or she's going to get obliterated.

09-27-2008, 05:25 AM	#1
Lord Blazer Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 16,879	1st Presidential Debate Wow. I hate to say it, but in the end it looks like the debate came out really even. I blame this mostly on the fact that every 20 seconds McCain would cut Obama off with some inane "Maverick this Obama did that or in my 26 years" while Obama was a polite gentleman and kinda waited for McCain to finish a lot. While this is an admirable trait, it's not really appropriate for a debate like that. The entire thing still felt a lot like McCain's approach has been thusfar, which has been 50% MAVERICK and 50% Obama bad but 0% this is what I'll do. Thoughts? I should not start political threads.

09-27-2008, 05:28 AM	#2
Shaun Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 17,881	did they plan the presidential debate for a Friday because they knew I would get drunk and miss it? I wanted to watch it.. god damn it. Who the hell's gonna watch it on a Friday night? God damn it
Shaun Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 17,881

09-27-2008, 06:04 AM	#4
Andres Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 17,797	Obama has the right arguments, he just doesn't know how to be forceful. His argument regarding how McCain makes a ridiculous deal about earmarks when they in no way cover up for his tax cuts is a good argument, but he is not forceful about it. Comes across half-assed. He has similar issues with other points. He is too respectul. Besides that, there are obvious things that politically you cannot say in America, but it's still sad to see the argument fall into that. In particular I am talking about these idiotic discussions about "nuclear iran" and these two guys trying to beat each other at the task of sucking on Israel's cock.
Andres Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 17,797

09-27-2008, 06:09 AM	#5
Orcus Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,146	They should test to see if McCain can pronounce 'Ahmadinejad' before he can actually beginning discussions on how to deal with Iran.
Orcus Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,146

09-27-2008, 06:10 AM	#6
Breed Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 7,768	That fucking smile on McCain drove me goddamn crazy
Breed Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 7,768

09-27-2008, 05:37 AM	#3
Aaron Haynes Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 15,125	McCain had this ugly sneer/smirk on his face every time Obama talked, like he didn't think he deserved to be on the same stage as the big boys. Obama was on defense a lot -- I think he was surprised by just how aggressively McCain spun out distortions and mischaracterizations, and repeatedly felt like he had to defend his record, which takes away precious time and audience focus. He fought back effectively, and with the exception of earmarks, which went on way too fucking long, he managed to keep the debate from being framed on McCain's terms. Unfortunately, that meant that he wasn't able to frame much on his own terms (especially with McCain sneering and scoffing at him the whole damn time). Obama looked magnanimous and presidential. McCain looked like a smirking, condescending asshole. It's hard to say who "won"; obviously Obama had the facts on his side and I agree with his policies more, but McCain did a good job of distracting. (Shaun: I'm sure it'll be available online at some point. They're replaying it on MSNBC at 4pm tomorrow, and I'm sure it'll re-air a bunch more times.)

09-27-2008, 06:39 AM	#7
Rabid Dinosaur Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 14,894	I watched this. McCain only made me say stuff to the TV a couple times.

09-27-2008, 06:42 AM	#8
Aaron Haynes Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 15,125	McCain got the last word on a lot of things just from interrupting and oversimplifying Obama's positions at the end of a few of those five-minute back-and-forth segments. Particularly the one on negotiating with Iran. SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS WE'LL JUST DISAGREE WITH AHMADINAMAJIDIANIAAD? HOW NAIVE. Most of what he did tonight was construct strawmen.

09-27-2008, 10:36 AM	#9
Kunio Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 7,837	to be fair if Obama was more forceful on calling him out the people would see him as a scary angry black man and a black man having opinions scares the people while a mummy threatening 3 countries at once is all cool *Götterdämmämerica*
Kunio Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 7,837

09-27-2008, 02:32 PM	#10
Bobby Swisha Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 46,012	Yeah pretty much whatever everyone else said. It surprised me just how much the two candidates hate each other, I thought they'd be more respectful of each other but I guess I was wrong. Why did the moderator let McCain talk and interrupt so damn much? They should have just cut him off.

09-27-2008, 03:18 PM	#11
Lord Blazer Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 16,879	There was one point where Obama said something about McCain or brought up a good point or something I don't quite recall, pretty early on, and McCain just looked SUPER FUCKING PISSED oh my god. And those who watched it on CNN: What the fuck was the point of the audience reaction meter thing?

09-27-2008, 03:47 PM	#12
Bobby Swisha Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 46,012	McCain really looked like he didn't want to share the stage with a black person. And Obama just looked like he was thinking "that motherfucker!!" the whole time. I liked how neither of them could answer the moderator on the economy and just kept talking about social programs/shitty tax breaks instead and he was just really frustrated by their stupid answers.

09-27-2008, 06:18 PM	#14
Shaun Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 17,881	What do they think he's gonna do when he gets into office? Assist terrorists in building a nuke, then flee the country?
Shaun Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 17,881

09-27-2008, 06:22 PM	#15
Space Goat Administrator Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 6,042	I was amused at how McCain repeatedly argued that "even Obama conceded the surge was a success" and "Obama still to this day refuses to acknowledge the surge worked" in the same breath.

09-27-2008, 06:25 PM	#17
Orcus Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,146	Any variation of Ahmadinejad that is not really Ahmadinejad should be on there too.
Orcus Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,146

09-27-2008, 06:45 PM	#18
Kunio Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 7,837	You do realize that if that rule was there you'd be pretty much drinking all the time correct
Kunio Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 7,837

09-29-2008, 02:31 PM	#19
Air Rick Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 6,733	you guys more or less put it more eloquently, but I watched it on a channel that mostly had the split-screen between the two, instead of focusing on one more that the other. But McCain looked like a dick. Really. He wouldn't even *look* at Obama, and even though Obama would say stuff like "McCain is absolutely right, and actually agree with McCain," McCain had nothing nice to say back, and instead attempted to make Obama look like a tool. So, of course, Obama spent a lot of time on the defensive... A horrible demeanor when debating if you ask me.
Air Rick Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 6,733

09-29-2008, 06:12 PM	#20
The Chinese Jew Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 14,225	Interesting column by Roger Ebert on the debate: http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/...TARY/809289997 I didn't see the debate, but the two things I heard about from quite a few people was how Obama said numerous times, "John Mccain is right when he says this..." and how Mccain just wouldn't look at Obama at all when he talked. Though, that could be a lack of confidence. I heard that during the Bush vs. Clinton debates, Bush was looking at his watch when talking.

09-29-2008, 06:58 PM	#21
Air Rick Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 6,733	that's actually a very good article. Sums up what I wanted to say pretty nicely. "Contemptuous behavior" is definitely what I'd call it...
Air Rick Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 6,733

09-29-2008, 11:33 PM	#22
Bob Toasted Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 4,909	My favorite part was when Jim Leher had to repeat the purpose of the question over and over and ended up yelling at the two. It was like being in high school and no one did their homework.

09-29-2008, 11:49 PM	#23
Aaron Haynes Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 15,125	Hahaha, yeah. He was trying to get them to specify which of their proposed programs they'd have to cut from the budget due to the economy shitting right through its pants. Certainly Obama wouldn't be willing to say, as it'd be a tacit admission that that particular subject isn't going to get any work done on it during his first term. If he said his health care proposal would be delayed, there'd be an attack ad put out by the McCain campaign before the debate was even over.

09-29-2008, 11:49 PM	#24
Notch Johnson Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 4,503	oh god i cant wait.

09-30-2008, 12:29 AM	#25
Bob Toasted Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 4,909	Oh god. She better have something up her sleeve or she's going to get obliterated.