The "Farenheit 9/11" Megathread

[Sammy Sagitarius]

So, I saw it today [friday morning], and here's what I thought:

So, I was extremely tired going on, by my own fault, so i'm not claiming I was all perky and awaiting anxiously. Here's what the movie did: Made my jaw drop, made me glad i'm a democrat, made me cry twice, made me question several moore tactics.

This movie is great. It just IS. Realistically, anyone who doesn't like it, is a Moore-basher in the first place. First of all, Michael Moore NARRATES this film. His onscreen time is almost moot. He does a few "Awful Truth" styled gimmicks. Those are fine and dandy. I'll admit I didn't care for the Ask-The-Senator-For-Their-Kids or the Ice-Cream-Truck-Patriot-Act... I liked his point, but the highlights of this film were when Bush was being quoted, and shown to be the total ass he is. The stuff he says... "We'll get terrorists. Watch this swing." - "The haves, and the have mores. You're the elite, you're my base."

The fact that all of that bullshit went on and nobody ever questioned it. The opening of the film, with the black men and women trying desperately to prevent the horrible treachery that has been the Bush Administration but with no Signatures... it was desperate. The mother of the army kid, the letter, especially her visit to Washington.

This movie a) relied on music. b) stated only what it needed to to prove a point. c) did what EVERY documentary does, and was definately slanted.

I see no fault with this film. It was humurous, but not nearly as humurous as some of his previous work. It was dramatic, but not melodramatic. And frankly, the way he covered 9/11's attacks - RAMZA - was extremely mature. Anyone what watches it would agree he did NOT exploit it and did not try to capitalize on the attacks in any way. He simply told some truths that I'm glad people will hear.

How many Republicans know the long history between the Bin Ladens, the Saudi Government, and the Bush dynasty? I mean, if your best friend's girlfriend steals your gold watch, you AREN'T going to get reliable results if your friend is doing the investigating. It just doesn't happen. That's a lot like what happened with our government.

Who pays the Bush's more... America or Saudi Oil Leaders? Not America. So what matters most to the Bush family? NOT AMERICA.

Yeah, he does a great job of giving his sources, with exception to VERY NOTICABLE minor points... (the guy who said "i've HEARD it's around 7% of America") I mean, there was no proof of some of his numbers. But the thing is, the videos speak for themselves. Whenever Buch is speaking, it's CROPPED, but not trick-edited. He DID say those things, all we lose is the context. But, frankly, most of his lines - fuck the context. There is NO context where those comments are appropriate.

And as far as the complaint about the final clip of Bush... what's wrong with that? He had no idea what he meant, and he came off like a dumbass. Sure, it's a low blow, but can anyone deny he did it to himself? It was him talking, not Michael Moore.

I loved it. EVERYONE, especially those who support Bush, should SEE this film. People who attack something without understanding it... They're the reason this country ISN'T the best in the world.

They're the POINT of the title.

Farenheit 451 -- the government controls the info by burning the books.

Farenheit 9/11 -- the government calls you unpatriotic and unworthy when you exercise your PATRIOTIC DUTY to question the way you're being required to live.

One of the best lines? "Only the foreign press covered the story." That's right, America wasn't allowed to be honest.

Frankly, people who support Bush just don't make sense. They aren't free thinkers. They aren't being logical.

It's not about Republican and Democrat - it's about Bush being the worst president in our lifetime.

And, Travis, your mom is stupid. Clinton was an AMAZING PRESIDENT, just an immoral man. When it comes down to the job, the thing we elected him to do, he did it very well. It's America's own fault for CARING about where his dick was that anything ever happened.

---
So, yeah, I stopped reviewing and started harping a bit. Let's argue.

[Kunio]

Here's LiquorHead's review! And it's "LOL BUSH IS DUMB" or "MOORE IS FAT" free! AMAZING! (http://www.retrocrush.com/archive2004/fahrenheit/index.html)

[Sammy Sagitarius]

Wow, I like that LiquorHead review. Sounds like the one and only impartial review this film will ever get.

[Ramza Brave]

Michael Moore is a fat idiot.

[Fat Puppy]

Good work stringing two "insults" together, Ramza. Next time, lets not be retarded and back up what we say, shall we?

[Andres]

No shit.

[Damien Jasper]

Look, I don't adore the idea of going at it with Ramza again, but is that the ONLY thing people have on Moore, is that he's obese? So's Dick Cheney. So what, just because Moore is fat that suddenly means that it's okay for Bush to spend 42% of his time golfing instead of running the country? Good hell.

[Jimmah]

Yeah but he is fat.

And fat people can't write books or make films.

Oooh but that "Michael Moore hates America" film looks pretty interesting, cus it doesn't seem to be from a Republican stance but an actual person who's not a complete twat's stance.

[Damien Jasper]

Funny how Faux News tries to say the movie will be a tremendous failure because there's just not an audience for Moore's type of stuff. They insist all of America is really behind Bush and this country is right wing dammit! And it's the most wonderfulest country in the whole wide world because of it! Funny how this movie, despite having no audience, is selling out everywhere it goes and has a new record for wide release of a documentary. If this is what the US passes of as "Fair and Balanced" news, then it deserves bad leadership.

I can't wait until the Rapture.

[Ramza Brave]

Originally posted by Fat Puppy
Good work stringing two "insults" together, Ramza. Next time, lets not be retarded and back up what we say, shall we?


Ok, here's one for you. Dumbass tryhard cock. Wow, even more words?


I'm sick of a guy that goes around milking disasters for money and fame. He's trying to con more people into thinking he's "cool" just becuase he can go around and say, "DID TWO PLANES CRASH INTO THE TWIN TOWERS?! DID IT?!!? *takes a bite of a donut*. He's full of shit, and he'd probably never stick his face into real danger like a REAL reporter. Praise the mother fuckers that goto that shit hole sand nigger land, Iraq. They bring in the real shit, and actually report. This guy rehashes shit that everyone knows happen so he can build fame and money and try to make himself a hero.

[Jason Ruiz]

http://graphics7.nytimes.com/images/2002/06/28/national/28drug.jpg
http://www.disasturbation.com/files/hellout.wav

[Damien Jasper]

Milking disasters to make himself a hero? Ramza, you're describing George Bush. Those 'real stories' they bring back are wonderful clips of our heroic boys in uniform either getting blown up, protecting oil wells or torturing prisoners. I don't admire that.

Why is it that when someone questions a Republican president, they are suddenly a traitor? Clearly Moore just thinks this country isn't being the best it can be. That's actual patriotistm. PATRIOTISM IS NOT FOLLOWING THE PRESIDENT AROUNT WITH YOUR HAT IN YOUR HAND BEGGING FOR A CRUMB AND THANKING HIM WHEN HE FUCKS YOU IN THE ASS AND THEN TELLS YOU HE DID IT!!! AND FUCK YOU IF YOU THINK ANY DIFFERENT!

Anyway, this debate is giving me a cardiac episode, so I better split.

[Andres]

Originally posted by Ramza Brave



Ok, here's one for you. Dumbass tryhard cock. Wow, even more words?


I'm sick of a guy that goes around milking disasters for money and fame. He's trying to con more people into thinking he's "cool" just becuase he can go around and say, "DID TWO PLANES CRASH INTO THE TWIN TOWERS?! DID IT?!!? *takes a bite of a donut*. He's full of shit, and he'd probably never stick his face into real danger like a REAL reporter. Praise the mother fuckers that goto that shit hole sand nigger land, Iraq. They bring in the real shit, and actually report. This guy rehashes shit that everyone knows happen so he can build fame and money and try to make himself a hero.

What the fuck are you talking about, retard? Half the movie IS in that "shit hole sand nigger land", you dumb piece of shit.

[Fat Puppy]

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
I'm sick of a guy that goes around milking disasters for money and fame. He's trying to con more people into thinking he's "cool" just becuase he can go around and say, "DID TWO PLANES CRASH INTO THE TWIN TOWERS?! DID IT?!!? *takes a bite of a donut*. He's full of shit, and he'd probably never stick his face into real danger like a REAL reporter. Praise the mother fuckers that goto that shit hole sand nigger land, Iraq. They bring in the real shit, and actually report. This guy rehashes shit that everyone knows happen so he can build fame and money and try to make himself a hero.
I like how that can pretty much sum up my opinion of George W. Bush, sans the reporting.

[Ramza Brave]

you're missing what i'm saying you ignorant spic. He's still milking the disasters for fame and money. This is what I see from him. I haven't seen Farenheight 911. So I assumed he didn't go. Big woop, he probably had super security and hid in a little bungalo.

[Ramza Brave]

Bush is a piece of shit too. I'm not debating that.

[Fat Puppy]

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
you're missing what i'm saying you ignorant spic. He's still milking the disasters for fame and money. This is what I see from him. I haven't seen Farenheight 911. So I assumed he didn't go. Big woop, he probably had super security and hid in a little bungalo.

What the fuck do you think the other reporters do there? Go out unarmed with no security at all? Are you fucking retarded?

[Ramza Brave]

Dude, you're an idiot. Alot of reporters went into dangerous situations and some died. IE Dan Pearl. You're fucking retarded and missing the point I'm making. Stop beating around it and look at what I'm saying instead of speculating errors like a dumb prick.

[Andres]

So the stuff that's in the movie doesn't count unless he's shot?


What the FUCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?!? We don't get the point because there's no point, stupid.


And milking tragedies? Then Spielberg must be a cocksucking asshole, right? RIGHT?

[Ramza Brave]

He's just stirring up bullshit for fame and money. PURE AND SIMPLE. Alright I gtg, going out of state. So if you think I'm wrong/stupid, then ignore me and continue this discussion about the main topic. Later

[Andres]

WRONG.

[Jason Ruiz]

OWNED.

[Crazy Ivan]

Ramza, shut up until you've actually seen the movie. I saw it last night, and it was great, though there were defenitely things about it that I disagreed with (not the points he was making, but the way he was making them. Especially the last footage of Bush that he shows). And let it be known that not one single person in the history of the world has ever made a documentary in the hopes of getting rich. THERE IS NO MONEY IN MAKING DOCUMENTARIES.

[AR-Raven]

If you're a strong Bush supporter, this film will likely get you mad, and you'll just call Moore a stupid asshole. If you're a fan of Moore's work, you'll love it. If you like watching "the camera keeps rolling" footage of politicians doing goofy things, you'll adore it. And if you're just sort of on the fence about everything, like I was, just maybe you'll make up your mind about Bush once and for all and vote in this election with a passion. There's no smoking gun in this film. To point out that Bush may not be the most capable man that's ever held the office of President is no new revelation. But if Moore can convince more people to speak with the vote, then I'd call this film a success.

[AR-Raven]

And maybe Moore is a stupid asshole who likes to stir up bullshit. And that's the wrong opinion that you have, man. This film isn't about Moore, it's about Bush. Just because the first two star wars sucked doesn't mean I'm going to openly hate the next Spielberg blockbuster. This movie only has facts in it, you can make up your mind about what they add up to. But you can't instantly bash the movie because you hate Moore, which is what every Bush supporter is going to turn to. It makes a lot of very good points, and you can't let your president brand loyalty get in the way of the really obvious stuff. Bush is an idiot.

[Travis Wells]

El Grande: What's Farenheit 9/11?
Mom: It's a very inaccurate attack on the president.
El Grande: Oh
Mom: I don't think people should attack the president, I mean it's not like he's a bad president like Bill Clinton
El Grande: Yeah.


Living in the south is SO VERY MUCH FUN.

[Jimmah]

Jim : You gunna see Farenheit 9/11?
Mates : What's that?
Jim : That new film/documentary by Michael Moore.
Mates : ....who's Michael Moore?
Jim : ....the bloke who did Bowling for Columbine.
Mates : .....je pleu?

[Deano]

It's scary to think, no matter who runs the country, bush or democrats, it's still the same group of indulstrialist scumfucks behind both of them telling them what to do
[/bill hicks]

[BR]

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
you're missing what i'm saying you ignorant spic. He's still milking the disasters for fame and money. This is what I see from him. I haven't seen Farenheight 911. So I assumed he didn't go. Big woop, he probably had super security and hid in a little bungalo. Calling someone ignorant and then calling them a spic...? Isn't that kind of an oxymoron?

[BR]

Originally posted by Travis Wells
Living in the south is SO VERY MUCH FUN. Hey, I happen to live in the south, and I LIKE it here. Don't stereotype my south just cause your household is stupid. Thanks.

[Cal Flavell]

Haha. Travis has a stupid mother.

[Jason Ruiz]

MICHAEL MOORE SHOULD KILL HIMSELF AND MAKE IT LOOK LIKE THE GOVERNMENT DID IT. THEN EVERYONE WINS.

[Flounder]

MICHAEL MOORE SHOULD TAKE A SHIT IN BUSH'S BED. THAT'D SHOW HIM.

[AR-Raven]

I want to take a shit in Bush's bed. What a total idiot president. My friend has the bumper sticker "Lick Bush" and now I want one

[Sinarach]

I saw him on the David Lettermen show. He seemed slow and wasn't focused. He also got agitated easily.

I'd like to go and see how Moore performs in front of his own cameras, as oppose to someone elses.

But I don't have much interest in American politics.

[Bob Toasted]

So many jokes I can make about him hijacking an ice cream truck.

[Bob The Ninja]

Yeah, saw the first showing this morning. Loved it.

What I find interesting is how no republican is trying to explain the other side of what Moore is saying. They're all just droneing on about how he's fat and stirring up shit instead of disproving what is being said, if that's even possible.

I never really trusted Bush, but after seeing the countless facts Moore presented which I had never even heard about, I realized just how deep this republican bullshit goes.

Edit: Yeah. I dont follow politics. So I dont really know about any of this stuff.

[Cheezemaster]

I saw it.
it was ok.
I almost laugh at the 'damaged' arm of that iraqui kid.
but I didn't.
'cause I was with Her.

[Bob The Ninja]

Um, the dead and injured kids was the saddest part for me. :(...

[Jason Ruiz]

You guys are so ignorant. THOSE IRAQI KIDS DID 9/11.

[Bob Toasted]

Oh and I thought the movie sucked. Not because it was biased. But because it was boring. I knew about EVERYTHING he talked about already. It was so boring throughout the whole thing, which was a surprise to me, considering the reason I like him is because he can make boring shit seem interesting. I did like when he interviewed the troops that were out in Bahgdad because other interveiwers on news stations had them seem very upstanding and nice. These dudes seemed like the new age vietnam war soldiers. Other than that it was pretty gay. On the edge of entertaining and boring. I'd say if you haven't seen it, you won't miss much by waiting till it comes on TV.

[Brix]

why didn't you just shout "OLD!" or "NOT VERY NEW!" and leave?

[Bob Toasted]

oh yeah, there wasn't enough gore in it for me. The kid's arm was cool, when I saw it I was liek "RAWK!" and I got up and did some air guitar.

[Bob Toasted]

Originally posted by Brix
why didn't you just shout "OLD!" or "NOT VERY NEW!" and leave? I paid 7 bucks for a ticket. Plus I had to finish my popcorn.

[Steve Adair]

Thanks for ruining the movie for me Mr. Movieruinerman.

[Bob The Ninja]

I got in for free. I paid for a pretzel, though. It was alright I guess.

[BR]

Originally posted by Pikios
I saw him on the David Lettermen show. He seemed slow and wasn't focused. He also got agitated easily.

I'd like to go and see how Moore performs in front of his own cameras, as oppose to someone elses.

But I don't have much interest in American politics. Well, you might be once you actually see the movie. :)

[Steve Adair]

What was that one movie Michael Moore made about big companies like General Motors?

[Andres]

roger & me.

[Damon Friend]

Haven't seen it, but I've read some reviews that basically sound like what I expected.

http://politics.slate.msn.com/id/2102723/
http://movie-reviews.colossus.net/movies/f/fahrenheit_911.html

interesting reads coming from both sides.

[Andres]

Originally posted by Damon Friend
Haven't seen it, but I've read some reviews that basically sound like what I expected.

http://politics.slate.msn.com/id/2102723/
http://movie-reviews.colossus.net/movies/f/fahrenheit_911.html

interesting reads coming from both sides.

Christopher Hitchens is a goddamn moron.

[Damon Friend]

k

[BR]

Yeah, Christopher Hitchens can suck my balls.

[Frogman]

John Kerry is a fucking idiot.

[BR]

Good argument.

[Frogman]

the point is, just as much crooked shit goes on in the democratic party as in the republican party, thats how polotics are. this movie is just showing you what it wants to show you so that it can get you to think a certain way about the republican party. what a coincidence that it came out 5 months before the elections :rolleyes

[Bob The Ninja]

I should move to Austrailia because this whole country is just going to Hell.

[Damon Friend]

I honestly don't give a fuck what you think of Christopher Hitchens, I was just saying that I enjoyed reading both sides of what people thought of the movie. Bush supporter and non-Bush supporter (can't really call them a Kerry supporter, because I mean, who supports Kerry?)

[BR]

Originally posted by Frogman
the point is, just as much crooked shit goes on in the democratic party as in the republican party, thats how polotics are. this movie is just showing you what it wants to show you so that it can get you to think a certain way about the republican party. what a coincidence that it came out 5 months before the elections :rolleyes Wow dude! You're right! Five months before the election!! It's almost like it's some kind of CONSPIRACY!?!?!?!

[Zaquis]

Originally posted by Bob The Ninja
I should move to Austrailia because this whole country is just going to Hell.

Hi. I'm the rest of the world.

I'm going ot hell, too.

[Allergic 2 Life]

good movie

[Allergic 2 Life]

http://web.njit.edu/~pmm3/lollercaust.gif

[Sinarach]

I'm loving that GIF.

[Frogman]

Originally posted by BR
Wow dude! You're right! Five months before the election!! It's almost like it's some kind of CONSPIRACY!?!?!?!

===========D ~o ~o ~o :(
UU

[Kunio]

In other news, I wish I knew what was up with the latest Bush campaign ad (http://www.georgewbush.com/Default.aspx).
Could someone explain this to me? Has Bush gone pessimist? Or calling the Democrats retarded? NANDE YA NEN PEOPLE.

[Whitey]

YEAH GUYS. MICHAEL MOORE TOTALLY EXPOLOITS 9/11 FOR HIS PERSONAL GAIN!!!

Bush and the Republican party would never do anything like that though. They'd never use 9/11 footage in campaign ads or hold the Republican National Convention in New York City near ground zero. They also wouldn't push the date of the convention later so that it would be closer to the anniversary of 9/11.

NOPE. THEY WOULDN'T DO THAT SHIT.

[Dustin Guest]

Okay, I haven't seen the movie yet because we were celebrating my friend's 21st last night. But from what I've seen of Moore's work (bowling for columbine), I don't care for it. His message isn't wrong, but his method of doing it is like an obnoxious kid who just learned a swear word and is using it in arguments. And aren't documentaries supposed to be unbiased? I just plain don't like Michael Moore. I think he's an asshole, so I'm gonna wait till this comes out on HBO or something where I don't have to give an asshole my money. Once again, I tend to agree with the message he sends out, but I hate the way he presents things. He's such an obnoxious, self-righteous prick and his tirade at the academy awards was really childish. He looked like an annoying tryhard teenager trying to be rebellious. Yes, this country is in a dark period right now. This election is giving us a tough choice. Neither leading candidate is going to be too good for this country. Bush has caused a lot of shit and I don't think Kerry will do any better. Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

[Whitey]

There's no such thing as an "unbiased" documentary.

[Kunio]

NOW BACK ON EARTH IS TIME FOR ZOUND SPLASH (http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0406/25/lkl.00.html)
Refer to the first paragraphs of the Liquorhead review I posted on the second post of this thread.

[Dustin Guest]

Originally posted by Whitey
There's no such thing as an "unbiased" documentary. Yeah, there is. It shows BOTH sides of an argument rather than attempts to villify someone.

[Andres]

Originally posted by Dustin Guest
And aren't documentaries supposed to be unbiased? I just plain don't like Michael Moore.

No, and he's said before that this documentary (F911) is NOT fair.

[Andres]

Originally posted by Frogman
what a coincidence that it came out 5 months before the elections :rolleyes

When the hell did you expect it to come out? AFTER the elections?

[Whitey]

Originally posted by Dustin Guest
Yeah, there is. It shows BOTH sides of an argument rather than attempts to villify someone.

No. Documentaries always reflect the point of view of the director. Even if a film claims to "show both sides", there is always a bias. It's like when Bill O'Reilly says that his show is the "no spin zone" and shit.

And yeah...when the fuck did Michael Moore ever say that his movies and books were NOT slanted toward his point of view? This is a movie from the point of view of a liberal. Why can't people get this through their heads? He's never hidden the fact that his movies are one-sided. They are supposed to be.

Now excuse me...I have to go attack Steven Spielberg for not showing the Nazi point of view in SCHINDLER'S LIST.

[Space Goat]

Originally posted by Andres De La Hoz


When the hell did you expect it to come out? AFTER the elections? No kidding, that was the whole point. Expect the DVD to be released in late October.

[Damon Friend]

Originally posted by Whitey
YEAH GUYS. MICHAEL MOORE TOTALLY EXPOLOITS 9/11 FOR HIS PERSONAL GAIN!!!

Bush and the Republican party would never do anything like that though. They'd never use 9/11 footage in campaign ads or hold the Republican National Convention in New York City near ground zero. They also wouldn't push the date of the convention later so that it would be closer to the anniversary of 9/11.

NOPE. THEY WOULDN'T DO THAT SHIT.

so... since Bush does it, and even though Moore is 100% against Bush, that makes it ok for Moore to do himself? I'm not sure I understand the thought process behind that....

[Andres]

How is he exploiting it? There isn't even footage from the 911 crashes in the movie. If you're suggesting "using it as a basis for the movie" is exploiting it, then you should really start considering every single person who ever did anything remotely connected to reality as being an exploiter.

[Space Goat]

Bush losing this election is hardly one man's personal gain. It's more like a victory for the entire free-thinking peoples of the world.

[Whitey]

That's what I'm trying to say. Yeah...Moore did a documentary that was related to 9/11. So that means he's exploiting it? So when all of the newspapers and magazines did reports on the tragedy in the weeks following 9/11 they were just doing so for financial gain and nothing else?

The point I was attempting to make was that you could make the same accusation about ANYONE...even the President himself.

[Jason Ruiz]

MICHAEL MOORE ONCE KILLED A FLY WITH A BOOMERANG. HE WAS PRETTY MODEST ABOUT IT.

[BR]

Originally posted by Whitey
That's what I'm trying to say. Yeah...Moore did a documentary that was related to 9/11. So that means he's exploiting it? So when all of the newspapers and magazines did reports on the tragedy in the weeks following 9/11 they were just doing so for financial gain and nothing else?

The point I was attempting to make was that you could make the same accusation about ANYONE...even the President himself. Time for a LJ update?!

[Deano]

you know what, I'll seriously cry if conservative win the next election, and on australia's point of view, it looks like conservative will win.
the alternative government are making policy decisions that are too far fetched and controversial to gain more support. I reckon they are doing it on purpose so conservative DO win. The politician's buttons are getting pushed, a left wing government's role is not one to solve wars, so we have to put up with right wing.
I dont really give a shit about their internal policy of the country, the big topic I want solved is Iraq. If there was no situation in Iraq I would vote independant and sit back being not responsible for the ways the government fucks us. Left or right, we're getting screwed anyways. But with Iraq I will vote Left and hope to god things get better. And if it gets to drafting, well I guess I'll have to camp out in the bush or move to another country, I'm not sure, how do you escape drafting guys?

I'm ashamed of my country, you could pretty much call it America 2 now. Both countries are filled with absent minded sheep who believe whatever bias the television imposes on them, so, we have a lot of people voting right wing.

[Sammy Sagitarius]

Froggy... thank GOD this came out before the election.

And my stance on Kerry? I don't give a fuck. The man is way too low-key and hasn't said ANYTHING worth paying attention to. I imagine he's waiting until closer to the election, because really, just sitting there doing nothing, while Bush destroys himself with this war, is a pretty good method. Sure, accuse of him being inactive... but by not doing anything, he's winning my vote so far. And then this movie comes out I'm determined to get ANYBODY WHO ISN'T A BUSH FAMILY MEMBER in office... and voting independent is the same thing as not voting, period. Like they'd ever win again. Sure, I'm all for a third party, but at a time like this, leave your personal statements at home and vote against Bush.

So, in September, I imagine Kerry's campaigns will kick in. And he'll likely avoid 9/11 footage, that is, if he's smart.

**something i noticed at the film... most of the audience was black and most black people are democrats (because a black republican doesn't make sense). Too bad, really, because I'd hoped that a lot of the audience would be republicans. Either way, as long as this movie destroys the "undecided" voters by throwing them to the democrats, I'm happy.

[Evan]

Dean :

Don't you live in Australia?

They're Starting a Draft?

I'm dumb?

[Sammy Sagitarius]

http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/nsc/lowres/nscn27l.jpg

[Deano]

IF evan, IF Australia turns to drafting people I'm going to try all measures to escape it
hah, my dad's a right wing supporter so his business can go along smoothely, but if right wing wins this election, and IF they draft Australians, and I get drafted, his favourite political party will have placed his own son with a chance of death.

Sammy that cartoon's awesome
And as I said in my post, I will vote left this election, but if it weren't for iraq, I would vote third party

[Damien Jasper]

Oh, I love this shit. If nothing else, it actually puts me on the same side with Space Goat, Andres and Crazy Ivan and that really never happens.

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Space Goat
Bush losing this election is hardly one man's personal gain. It's more like a victory for the entire free-thinking peoples of the world.

Jeez, I LOVE having Space Goat on our side. Pretty much because no one has the balls to talk back to him the way they do each other. I agree 900% with your statement by the way. I CAN'T WAIT UNTIL RAPTURE.

[Digital Taco]

Space Goat likes NASCAR, and even he doesnt want Bush reelected. That's gotta mean something.

[Damon Friend]

Originally posted by Sammy Sagitarius
and voting independent is the same thing as not voting, period. Like they'd ever win again. Sure, I'm all for a third party, but at a time like this, leave your personal statements at home and vote against Bush.

The whole point of voting is to vote for who you want. So instead you are telling people to drop their opinions because your opinion is the best and you think that their opinion doesn't matter if they can't win? That's pretty lame dude. I personally don't give a shit who anyone votes for as long as they are voting. My opinion is my opinion, and theirs is theirs, so as long as they are voting for what they believe in, then the system is doing what it should do. I live in Washington, does that mean that I shouldn't vote just because the democrats always win anyways?

The whole idea of voting for Nader is throwing your vote away is bullshit. At least you are voting for who you believe in instead of just some guy whose political ideas are unknown to you.

You guys think that the idea of voting for Bush is stupid, well, I think the idea of voting for someone whose political asperiations are uknown is stupid aswell. I'd rather see someone who knows the views of Nader and agrees with him put his vote towards Nader then someone who is just voting because it's not Bush. Does that mean that I think you would be throwing away your voter? NO! The only way you can 'throw away' your vote is to not vote at all.

[BR]

Damon, you seem to understand politics about as well as a mouse understands a mousetrap.

You see Bush promising you a happy ending to the war in Iraq and you go for it, dismissing all else, just like the mouse goes for the cheese, not noticing the mousetrap until it rips his body in half.

[Brix]

Voting 3rd party is just throwing your vote away, you're better off not voting at all.

[Zaquis]

The only reason it's that way is 'cuz that's how everyone thinks.

[Bob The Ninja]

But the way everyone thinks isnt going to change anytime soon, I dont think.

[Damon Friend]

....wow

[Zaquis]

Originally posted by Bob The Ninja
But the way everyone thinks isnt going to change anytime soon, I dont think.

I know, I was just MAKING A POINT you jackass.

[Bob The Ninja]

AW DUDE MY BAD. :(!

[Zaquis]

Your bad indeed.

[Qaz]

I saw the movie last night, pretty good, but nothing too great, Bowling for Columbine was MUCH better.

I'm kinda with Lil' Bobby T on this one, I knew most of the stuff before hand, and it was a little boring, I just expected more.

Also I agree with Patencio, I don't have a problem with the facts or the message, just the way he showed some stuff was way off. Like the kids in Iraq playing and having a great time, I really had a problem with that, we all know Iraq wasn't a great place to live. And it kinda made Saddam and Iraq seem like this little innocent country that America just attacked. There's more too it, Saddam was an evil dictator that was killing thousands of innocent civilians before the war...but this movie didn't want to mention that.

It's weird I hate Bush and the Republicans, but I hate propaganda just as much, and this was just a 2 hour long Anti-Bush propaganda film...I just could have been better.


and I laughed really hard at the Ricky Martin part, very lol

[Andres]

Originally posted by Damon Friend
The whole point of voting is to vote for who you want.

Only a child would think something so patently naive.

[Tuffe John]

I saw it today, It was great, even if i like his other movies/tvseries more...it felt like I allready knew everything it told me.

[Sammy Sagitarius]

Damon, you're talking about the wrong America - the fantasy America that we've been TOLD we live in, not the real one that's being run for money instead of for values.

[Damon Friend]

Originally posted by Andres De La Hoz


Only a child would think something so patently naive.

Well, I'm voting for who I want anyways, you people do whatever you want, it just makes since to me.

[Qaz]

you're old enough to vote???

[Brix]

Unless the voting age is dropped to 17, thankfully not

[Sammy Sagitarius]

All any of us are getting at is that voting for anyone outside of the two major parties is all fine and dandy in the average election - it's still basically meaningless, but it doesnt do much harm - but in THIS election, it's a bad idea.

Because the average 3rd party voter, if necessary, would vote democrat. Therefore, THROWING THE VOTE AWAY to a person who WILL NOT WIN, EVER - like the third party at this point in history - means that it's one less potential democrat vote. And getting rid of Bush IS the most important thing for this country.

If not for the fact that he can't be trusted, alone. We KNOW he's deceitful and harmful to us.

[Jason Ruiz]

Fahrenheit 9/11 sucked, Sammy. Realize this.

[Travis Wells]

So I should always vote for the person most likely to win? Thanks for the info, Sammy!

[Damon Friend]

That's what I'm trying to say. Just because you think that Bush is bad and should be out of office doesn't mean that everyone else believes that. The people are 'throwing their vote away' for someone who they find to be more qualifying then Bush or Kerry. Do I agree that Nader is more qualified? Fuck no. Do I think that there vote is still put to good use. Yes.

[Damon Friend]

Originally posted by Qaz
you're old enough to vote???

I'm not talking about for this election, I miss it by 3 months, I'm talking about every election.

[Jason Ruiz]

Personally, I think a vote for Nadir is a character flaw.

The guy has no fucking personality what so ever.

[Sammy Sagitarius]

Fester, you're a political retard with no respect for people who have to work for everything they have only to be shortchanged by the government due to republican policy.

REALIZE THIS.

And, no, Travis. That's not what I said. I simply said never vote for someone you know can't win. Because it really IS a waste.

Voting for Nadar is the same as not voting, when the effectiveness of that action is seriously considered.

[Damon Friend]

IN RESPONSE TO FESTER: and I don't disagree, but you could say the same for Kerry.

[Damon Friend]

Originally posted by Sammy Sagitarius
Voting for Nadar is the same as not voting, when the effectiveness of that action is seriously considered.

So instead they should vote for someone whose views they don't believe in just because you want Bush out of office?

[Steve Adair]

Kerry is hot IMHO.

[Damon Friend]

http://www.evanderputten.org/special/stargazing/kerry.jpg

[Jason Ruiz]

KERRY RIDES FUCKIN MOTORCYCLES, DUDE.


PROOF? YOU WANT PROOF?! ILL GIVE YOU FUCKIN PROOF:

http://blog.johnkerry.com/jayjohn.jpg

http://www.gristmagazine.org/images/maindish/kerry_harley.jpg

oh and sammy, you do realize all my 'political standpoints' are all created in an attempt to piss you off, right?

Bush owns you.

[Damon Friend]

haha, that's awesome. It reminds me of Clinton showing off his sax skills on the late night shows

[Jason Ruiz]

http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Film/Pix/gallery/2003/03/24/Moore_.jpg
http://www.disasturbation.com/files/MOORE.wav

[Fat Puppy]

Originally posted by Damon Friend
haha, that's awesome. It reminds me of Clinton showing off his sax skills on the late night shows
Which helped increase his black demographic. Black people love Clinton. He should be Kerry's vice-prez. That would be amazing.

[Jason Ruiz]

but ironically enough, he hated black people.

[Steve Adair]

http://www.atomic-toaster.netfirms.com/uploaded/kerry.JPG

Thanks Bob Toasted for the uploader.

[Brix]

http://www.beldar.org/beldarblog/Kerry_snowboard.jpg

I'M JOHN KERRY AND I'M FUCKING AWESOME

[Zaquis]

http://www.sun-inet.or.jp/~mlbddf/bush.jpg
I'M GEORGE BUSH AND I'LL KICK YOUR ASS!

[Rabid Dinosaur]

Originally posted by Steve Adair
http://www.atomic-toaster.netfirms.com/uploaded/kerry.JPG...HAHAHA!

[Brix]

http://www.thetalentshow.org/images/kerry-flower.jpg

YOU'LL NEVAR CATCH ME! SNOWBOARDS TO CANADA

[Fat Puppy]

http://quest.cjonline.com/images/110700/nader.jpg
A VOTE FOR ME IS A VOTE FOR LIMP-WRISTED POLITICS!

[Sinarach]

Kerry is BADASS! Check him out on the bike and board. That's awesome! Imagine a president that spends his holidays away from the golf course, and on the snowfields fucking snowboarding! Holy shit! I wish he were my dad.

[Brix]

I bet Nader masturbates too much

[Fat Puppy]

http://quest.cjonline.com/images/110900/nader.jpg
Damn right I do. Thats why my hair is all mussed up and my face is slightly flushed.


...Nader in 2004!!

[Rabid Dinosaur]

It looks like he got his ass kicked and recovered from a deadly disease at the same time.

[Fat Puppy]

Seriously, Nader is ugly. When was the last time we had an ugly president? (Besides Nixon)

[Brix]

Regan looked kinda melted.

[Digital Taco]

he was just OLD. Reagan used to be SEXY
http://www.uno.edu/~tke/reagan.jpg

[Brix]

http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/academic/history/marshall/political/united_states/presidency/reagan.gif

OH GOD GET ME OUT OF THE MICROWAVE

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Zach Dobbels
http://www.sun-inet.or.jp/~mlbddf/bush.jpg
I'M GEORGE BUSH AND I'LL KICK YOUR ASS!

Go to hell.

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Brix
http://www.thetalentshow.org/images/kerry-flower.jpg

YOU'LL NEVAR CATCH ME! SNOWBOARDS TO CANADA

Last I checked, it was Cheney who dodged the draft and Bush who went AWOL.

[Gorosaurus]

Wow, you really need to SIMMA

[Damien Jasper]

What the fuck are YOU talking about? A vote for Bush is a vote for death, destruction, greed and assfucking the American people morning noon and night.

Get this, earlier this year, the Senate voted themselves a 4000 dollar a year pay raise from 152k to 156k. They called it "cost of living", on the VERY SAME DAY that 2 Oregon public schools were forced to close due to lack of funds. Meanwhile, minimum wage hasn't increased since '97 and cost of living hasn't been adjusted since '96 (for regular people that is). Sure, George Bush isn't in the senate, but guess who has to sign that piece of garbage into law? The PRESIDENT. I don't trust this fucking government to watch the water boil.

[Gorosaurus]

1. The President doesn't have to sign it, but if he vetoes, they'll just pass it as it goes through the senate again
2. Calm down, freakazoid. You're like the drama fairy godmother. No one said anything in defense of the Bush administration, you're delusional or just the most firebrand politically angst teenager I've ever encountered
3. You're blowing a gasket over harmless picture caption funnies. Do you realize that they don't have a deep, meaningful or subliminal message, just meant to entertain?


No, because YOU HAVE NO SENSE OF HUMOR, you bland personification of increasingly boring posts.

[Bob The Ninja]

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
the Senate voted themselves a 4000 dollar a year pay raise from 152k to 156k.

They should have just gotten DSL.

[Steve Adair]

You know how the whole senate sits in that big semi-circle?

Circle jerk anyone?

I know I would. :(

[Jason Ruiz]

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
What the fuck are YOU talking about? A vote for Bush is a vote for death, destruction, greed and assfucking the American people morning noon and night.

Get this, earlier this year, the Senate voted themselves a 4000 dollar a year pay raise from 152k to 156k. They called it "cost of living", on the VERY SAME DAY that 2 Oregon public schools were forced to close due to lack of funds. Meanwhile, minimum wage hasn't increased since '97 and cost of living hasn't been adjusted since '96 (for regular people that is). Sure, George Bush isn't in the senate, but guess who has to sign that piece of garbage into law? The PRESIDENT. I don't trust this fucking government to watch the water boil.

YOU ARE NOT THAT SMART.

[Qaz]

Originally posted by Bob The Ninja


They should have just gotten DSL.

haha, nerd humour, very lol and rofl

[Hail Caeser]

Originally posted by Fester Freelance
Personally, I think a vote for Nadir is a character flaw.

The guy has no fucking personality what so ever.

I disagree, hes rapped before:

Me name be Ralph Nader
Me gonna make an appeal
Homies, save the rainforest
Aye, keep it real

[JP]

:lol @ Jasper.

Seriously, those posts are the epitome of everything that disinterests me about my country's politics.

[Zaquis]

I bet those schools in Oregon were in the Portland disctrict.

Leave the Portland district out of this, they're having shitty times because of THEIR OWN retarded decisions. It's not the government's fault.

[BR]

This shit is serious
Do you really want beef?
Do you really want to end up missing your front teeth?

[Zaquis]

Yeah this is a ghetto piece of shit, nigga. Fuck this shit.

Fuck.

FUCK!

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK!

[Gorosaurus]

Hahaha, DSL

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Fester Freelance


YOU ARE NOT THAT SMART.

You are the fucking morons. This is the shit that affects you and me on a daily fucking basis. But you're all too fucking stupid or apathetic or both to go and find out. Just sit at home playing 3DMM or Quake or whatever. Any country this apathetic toward it's leadership DESERVES bad leadership. This is the youth vote and that's what fucking scares me. The reason the youth vote is so paltry is because it's fucking idiots like everyone on this board who are too fucking stupid to go out and do it. You fucking shitheads think everything will just work itself out. You are all LITERALLY the stupidest amaglation of people I have ever encountered in my life.

[Dave Miles]

hahah nobody likes you.

[Rabid Dinosaur]

Hey guys, I watched Bowling for Columbine today. It was GOOD. By the way, why is Damien Jasper getting so upset?

[Fat Puppy]

Originally posted by Damien Jasper


You are the fucking morons. This (...) life.
Dude, I agree with most of what you said, but I think you're a fucking asshole. Learn some people skills before you try to lecture anyone, idiot.

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Fat Puppy

Dude, I agree with most of what you said, but I think you're a fucking asshole. Learn some people skills before you try to lecture anyone, idiot.

How's this for people skills? Fuck you.

Is that good? No? Well, I'll keep trying with Eat Shit.

[Kunio]

Originally posted by Damien Jasper

PERA PERA PERA PERA PERA AMERICANS ARE LAZY GRRRRRRRRRRRR

You think that 3dmm is an actual representation of this country?
CHUPOPOPOPOPOOPOPOPOPOPOPOPOPOPPO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Dave Miles
hahah nobody likes you.

I wouldn't have it any other way dipshit.

[Jason Ruiz]

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
You are the fucking morons.

I AM NOT TWO PEOPLE.

[Bob The Ninja]

Hahaha, I wonder if Damien goes up to black people and yells and them about how he hates the KKK.

[Rabid Dinosaur]

HAHAHA!

[Jason Ruiz]

Originally posted by Dave Miles
hahah nobody likes you.

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
I wouldn't have it any other way dipshit.

http://www.disasturbation.com/files/nobody.wav

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Fester Freelance


I AM NOT TWO PEOPLE.

Fuckin hell. I rest my case about this idiot thing.

[Jason Ruiz]

I'm not the one that quoted me and then called me a morons.

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Fester Freelance




http://www.disasturbation.com/files/nobody.wav

Oh, I get it. If you say it instead of type it, I suddenly give more than a pile of maggot infested monkey shit (aka Your Brain). Is that how it works?

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Fester Freelance
I'm not the one that quoted me and then called me a morons.

Oh Lord, I can't believe I have to explain this. I wasn't just talking to you. You were just one example. Is that clear enough?

I can't believe I had to do that. Actually, I have no problem believing it. That's unspeakably hilarious and sad at the same time. Sorta like this place.

[Jason Ruiz]

Originally posted by Damien Jasper


Oh, I get it. If you say it instead of type it, I suddenly give more than a pile of maggot infested monkey shit (aka Your Brain). Is that how it works?

http://www.disasturbation.com/files/yup.wav

[Jason Ruiz]

Originally posted by Damien Jasper


Oh Lord, I can't believe I have to explain this. I wasn't just talking to you. You were just one example. Is that clear enough?

I can't believe I had to do that. Actually, I have no problem believing it. That's unspeakably hilarious and sad at the same time. Sorta like this place.

Then why didn't you quote them too dude? Were you too busy getting head from your super-model girlfriend to take the time to do that?

[Whitey]

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
Get this, earlier this year, the Senate voted themselves a 4000 dollar a year pay raise from 152k to 156k....Sure, George Bush isn't in the senate, but guess who has to sign that piece of garbage into law? The PRESIDENT. I don't trust this fucking government to watch the water boil.

Umm...actually that's prohibited under the 27th amendment. They didn't increase the pay for themselves. See...that increase won't take effect until after the next election year. So basically the senators would need to get elected again in order to see that extra 4000 bucks. The reason for this is so that the people can say "Hey wait a minute...that's gay what they just did there" and not vote the guy back in.

So like...I get what you're trying to say I suppose. But your point is kind of lame, and well...

Originally posted by Fester Freelance
YOU ARE NOT THAT SMART.

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Whitey


Umm...actually that's prohibited under the 27th amendment. They didn't increase the pay for themselves. See...that increase won't take effect until after the next election year. So basically the senators would need to get elected again in order to see that extra 4000 bucks. The reason for this is so that the people can say "Hey wait a minute...that's gay what they just did there" and not vote the guy back in.

So like...I get what you're trying to say I suppose. But your point is kind of lame, and well...



Oh, gee that makes it so much fucking better. It's still the government voting to pay itself even more. Cost of living? What? Is 152k a year not enough? What happened to the cost of living of the American people? (Which would include lots of people on this very board) The fact that anyone swallows this makes me fucking sick.

My point is, while public schools suffer and get closed down, the healthcare system collapses from within and Social Security is dead in the next few decades, they find enough money in our tax dollars to pay themselves more for the next time around. Why can't the money be diverted to something that is actually a priority? No no no. Instead, schools have to run bakesales in the vain hope that they can raise funds for enough overhead pens to make it through 9 months. Get the picture? Or is the math that fucking difficult? The people stopped being a priority a long time ago. That's not a surprise. But that we just let it happen. The government is supposed to ask us, not report to us. Instead we eat their shit and say "Mmmm! Good cook!"

[Whitey]

No...I don't get the picture. You're nitpicking over like...$400,000 a year. America spends over $1,000,000 on it's military alone every MINUTE.

So uh...in the time it took me to create this post, the US has spent over $400,000 on some new jet. If I were you, I'd make the point that military spending is outrageous, not the salary of some Senators.

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Whitey
No...I don't get the picture. You're nitpicking over like...$400,000 a year. America spends over $1,000,000 on it's military alone every MINUTE.

So uh...in the time it took me to create this post, the US has spent over $400,000 on some new jet. If I were you, I'd make the point that military spending is outrageous, not the salary of some Senators.

I honestly have no clue how much simpler I can make this. When was the last time they adjusted cost of living for the American people? And by 4 figures to boot? Just saying "Since they blow a bunch of money anyway, who cares?" is the equivalent of saying "Since they're gonna fuck us in the ass anyway, who cares if they lubricate?"

[Whitey]

When was the last time?

Err...how about the tax cut we recently had?

I'm not saying I support any sort of conservative economic theory...but technically yeah the cost of living for Americans was adjusted.

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Whitey
When was the last time?

Err...how about the tax cut we recently had?

I'm not saying I support any sort of conservative economic theory...but technically yeah the cost of living for Americans was adjusted.

OH. MY. GOD.

[Whitey]

See dude...I consider myself to be a left-leaning person. But I am also aware that most liberals are complete morons. It's just a bunch of people screaming out the same old arguements and making the same old points.

It never fails. Walk up to a liberal and say "tax cut". He'll roll his eyes and go "PSHHHH! TAX CUT! GAAAWD!" It's lame. It's like...talking to a robot.

MUST DISAGREE WITH EVERYTHING BUSH DOES. [/robot]

It's just stupid. And you seem to be the stereotypical liberal to me. So...just stop.

[Greg Aronov]

NIGGERS
lol

[Jason Ruiz]

Originally posted by Bob The Ninja


They should have just gotten DSL.

http://www.disasturbation.com/files/nickburns.wav

[Whitey]

GREG ARANOV: 5132 posts and counting of FRESH comedy.

[Jason Ruiz]

5312 to be precise.

[Whitey]

No, 5132 were FRESH comedy.

The rest were jokes stolen from you.

[Jason Ruiz]

What do you call a gathering of Martians?



...












































THE GREEN PARTY!!!

http://www.disasturbation.com/files/ROFLMAO.wav

[Zaquis]

So Damien, how about you stop your bitching, turn off the computer, get off your fat lazy ass, and go out and DO something about all these problems?

NAW, THAT TAKES TOO MUCH WORK! IT'S SO MUCH EASIER TO JUST TALK TO A BUNCH OF MIDDLE-CLASS TEENAGERS ON A BOARD AND YELL AT THEM ABOUT HOW THEIR COUNTRY SUCKS. YEAH, THAT MAKES A REAL DIFFERENCE IN THE LONG RUN!

Never cast your pearls before swine. Dipshit.

[Damage Jackal]

god, this is the most ridiculously hilarious thread i've ever read. basically, it seems to be everyone baiting damien jasper and him responding. it's awesome.

[Gorosaurus]

Haha, Damien killed Michael Moore and all of the points his movie could've brought forth for discussion in this topic.

It's kind of sad, because even the most prepubescent minded and grammatically challenged dislexic retard newbies here manage to find at least one other person to be their friend... online or off.

[Steve Adair]

I need a friend.

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Whitey
See dude...I consider myself to be a left-leaning person. But I am also aware that most liberals are complete morons. It's just a bunch of people screaming out the same old arguements and making the same old points.

It never fails. Walk up to a liberal and say "tax cut". He'll roll his eyes and go "PSHHHH! TAX CUT! GAAAWD!" It's lame. It's like...talking to a robot.

MUST DISAGREE WITH EVERYTHING BUSH DOES. [/robot]

It's just stupid. And you seem to be the stereotypical liberal to me. So...just stop.

I haven't disagreed w/ everything Bush has done. Fact of the matter is, I was 100% behind him when he said the U of M shouldn't be using race as their primary indicator of acceptance. I think affirmative action is bullshit. I also support the death penalty and a more stringent border policy and I believe in responsibility of the individual and not bullshit about psychic vampires such as "The Music made me do it". I also can't stand feminists. So don't call me a knee jerk liberal shit for brains.

[Jason Ruiz]

You're like those people that go, 'I'M NOT RACIST. I HAVE BLACK FRIENDS.'

[Bob The Ninja]

...What's wrong with feminists?

[Damien Jasper]

Originally posted by Fester Freelance
You're like those people that go, 'I'M NOT RACIST. I HAVE BLACK FRIENDS.'

I'm not even sure what you're getting at here. I freely admit to being politically liberal, but not in the rank and file manner wherein people say "These things are considered liberal therefore I believe them". I'm more like "I believe these things and people call them liberal". But I'm not going to pull a Rush Limbaugh and recoil at the idea of being called one and I don't just plain old disagree with everything George Bush does, just a great, great, great majority of it. Next time you post, have some substance.

Zach: That's pretty much what I do for a living, only last time I mentioned it people either found my occupation funny or had no fucking clue what it is.

[Jason Ruiz]

How's this for substance?:

I'm smarter than you.

[Damien Jasper]

Oh no. What will I do now that my world has been crushed?

[Sammy Sagitarius]

You know, the real one and only reason I'm liberal is because I believe in CHOICE.

Don't like abortion? CHOOSE not to have one.

Don't like gay marriage? CHOOSE not to marry the same sex.

Don't like to help everyone? CHOOSE not to be Canada.

So, yes, pretty much, I dislike the conservative WAY OF THINKING, in which, "If I don't like something, I'm going to make it so that no one can do it, ever" as opposed to the liberal way of thinking, which I find is, "If I don't like something, thank god I can choose to not participate."

The government of a "free country" shouldn't be telling people what they can and can't do as long as that person is dealing with themselves and others consentually.

For instance, if a person wants to die, why shouldn't he be allowed to pay a doctor to kill him painlessly?

My biggest problem with the Conservative Extremists is this constant desire to turn the bible into the constitution.

[Jason Ruiz]

Originally posted by Whitey
... But I am also aware that most liberals are complete morons. It's just a bunch of people screaming out the same old arguements and making the same old points.


Originally posted by Sammy Sagitarius
You know, the real one and only reason I'm liberal is because I believe in CHOICE.

Don't like abortion? CHOOSE not to have one.

Don't like gay marriage? CHOOSE not to marry the same sex.

Don't like to help everyone? CHOOSE not to be Canada.

So, yes, pretty much, I dislike the conservative WAY OF THINKING, in which, "If I don't like something, I'm going to make it so that no one can do it, ever" as opposed to the liberal way of thinking, which I find is, "If I don't like something, thank god I can choose to not participate."


http://www.disasturbation.com/files/this.wav

[Sammy Sagitarius]

[[insert fester's .wav: ROFL]]

[Jason Ruiz]

by the way, I'm assuming there are a few people who have been reading my comments and thinking, '... is Jason really a big fan of war?' or '... does Jason really support bush?' or '... is Jason really a conservative republican?'

What are my REAL viewpoints on this war, this movie, this president?

...

I think Carlin said it best:
http://www.disasturbation.com/files/carlin.wav


(I'm using it in a slightly different context, but it still gets my point across.)

[Sinarach]

Carlin sounds like a fag.

[Damien Jasper]

Where on earth did you get those soundbytes?

[Sammy Sagitarius]

Originally posted by Fester Freelance
by the way, I'm assuming there are a few people who have been reading my comments and thinking, '... is Jason really a big fan of war?' or '... does Jason really support bush?' or '... is Jason really a conservative republican?'

The soundbyte answered those questions HOW?

I'm not sure I understand what context you're using his words in...

You, Fester, are one of those people who... doesn't make up his mind, but watches everyone else fighting for entertainment?

[Valeris]

I should mention, I just read that the movie is coming into even more theatres after July 4th weekend. I think it'll reach a total of between 1700 and 1900 (but don't quote me). So hopefully I'll get to see it. Otherwise I think I wanna see Two Brothers, but the allure of F9/11 is pretty strong, especially after the trailer where Bush says "No watch this drive".

My goodness, the magestic leadership of this man just makes me all misty.

[Qaz]

Originally posted by Sammy Sagitarius


The soundbyte answered those questions HOW?

I'm not sure I understand what context you're using his words in...

You, Fester, are one of those people who... doesn't make up his mind, but watches everyone else fighting for entertainment?

I get what he's saying, makes sense to me.

[Jason Ruiz]

Yeah. I've considered that maybe I took it too far out of context, but... no. that makes perfect sense. Sammy's just a retard.

[Sammy Sagitarius]

Smarter than thou.

[Sammy Sagitarius]

EW: You had to be really disappointed by the opening-weekend gross, right? You almost got beat by ''White Chicks.''
MM: [Laughs] I was thinking 10 million. Twelve, maybe. It's like if this week the No. 1 album on the Billboard chart was a compilation of Bulgarian folk music. That can't happen! The pundits were saying that only the Bush haters would see this film, and it's No. 1 everywhere. The red states and the blue states.

[b]Was it your intention to take down Bush? [/b]
My intention was to make as good a film as I could make.

[b]But this movie is an explicit political attack. [/b]
If you start out with that as your primary motivation you're doomed. Case in point: ''The Day After Tomorrow.'' Well-intentioned. Good politics. I saw it at 10 p.m. opening night and there was so much laughter that people started chanting ''RE-FUND! RE-FUND! RE-FUND!'' ''China Syndrome'' is the opposite. Well-made movie first, and then people were willing to open up and listen to the politics.

[b]It seems to me that what you were trying to do was build the left's most sensational, potent case against this administration. [/b]
My own motivation [was the thought that] we can't leave this up to the Democrats. It's too serious now. I mean, this is a party that can't even win when they win. They lose when they win, you can't get more pathetic than that. We have to save them from themselves.

[b]Is this why you pushed for it to be released on June 25? And the October DVD date? To directly assist the Democrats in the election?[/b]
Yes.

[b]Talk to me about Lila Lipscomb, the mother of a soldier who died in Iraq. The story of her political conversion makes up roughly the last third of the movie. How did you find her? [/b]
I didn't know her at all. In the first month or two of the war, I noticed that [some] soldiers had died from Flint. I said we should start calling some of [their relatives] and see if they'll talk to us. The first three people said they would, so immediately we were like, whoa, because military families tend to be more conservative. As we followed Lila's story for three months there was a really interesting arc, because she was essentially this conservative Democrat, very pro-military. And we saw this shift take place over a period of months, and so you see it in the film.

[b]So the first time you met her, her son had already died in that helicopter crash? [/b]
That's right. It was a number of months after her son had died, I can get you the exact dates, but I just constructed it in such a way that you don't know he's dead until [later in the film].

[b]The first flash point for most people seems to be the footage of Bush in the grade-school classroom, when he is informed of the planes hitting the towers on 9/11. You are essentially imagining what Bush is thinking then. That's pretty audacious.[/b]
It's in a satirical voice. ''Which one of them screwed me?'' Clearly he's not thinking that, but yeah, I'm imagining that in a satirical voice.

[b]How'd you get the tape? [/b]
We called up [the school] and they said, ''Sure we made some tapes!'' Because parents wanted a tape of the President there. That's a home-video VHS that the teacher set on a tripod. And I'm telling you, we're being kind to Bush. You should see the longer version where I let it run for, like, three of the seven minutes. It is painful. PAINFUL!

[b]People have problems with your portrayal of kids playing in Baghdad before the bombings. I get what you're going for there, that those positive images were never seen, but Saddam was a bad guy and there's nothing to that effect in the film.[/b]
Who doesn't know that Saddam was a bad guy? The media did a wonderful job hammering that home every day in order to convince the public that they should support the war. For 20 seconds in this film, I become essentially the only person to say, I want you to take a look at the human beings that were living in Iraq in 2003. The ones that we were going to bomb indiscriminately. In those 20 seconds I show a child in a barbershop, a young boy flying a kite, a couple getting married. People having lunch at a café. Anyone who takes that and says that I'm trying to say that Saddam's Iraq was some utopia is just a crackpot. The New York Times reports that our air strikes that week were zero for 50 in terms of hitting the targets. We killed a lot of civilians, and I think that we're going to have to answer for that -- whether it's now or in the hereafter. If you pay taxes and you're an American your name is on those bombs. They were human beings who were just trying to get on with their daily lives.

[b]But if you'd just taken a second to show that they weren't exactly living under the best circumstances, that would have defused this criticism from the beginning. Right?[/b]
No.

[b]No? [/b]
I refuse to participate in the brainwashing that the media was doing to the American public. I didn't need to state the obvious. Kurt Vonnegut in ''Slaughterhouse-Five'' isn't criticized for not showing the horrors of the Nazi regime even though he shows that the people who we firebombed in Dresden were essentially old men, women, and children. Is he doing something dishonest or wrong? I know it upsets a lot of people in the media that I'm not playing ball, that I'm not showing the images that they showed. I know it's embarrassing to them because anybody who sees my film now knows that you were only presented with one side.

[b]There's a lot of stuff we haven't seen before in this movie. Wounded civilians, recuperating soldiers, casualties. How did you get it? [/b]
I realized early on that we were going to have to do an end run around those at the Pentagon and the way they were stage-managing the news. They successfully got the networks to drink the Kool-Aid. Some of it was from freelancers who were already there. Some of it was from freelancers we sent there. Some of it was from people who were there who we gave cameras to. Some of it was from foreign news. And some of it was from people in the American news media who were disgusted by how the news was being censored and filtered and that Americans were only given one view of the war.

[b]Is that where the footage of Bush after he addresses the nation on the golf course comes from?[/b]
Correct. Because a deal is made and this is what the deal is: Bush is on the golf course. So they allow a pool camera in only to film the statement he's going to give. Nothing before or after -- and if you do film [before or after] you're not to use it. And publicists from the White House will stand blocking the camera before the statement starts and then move right back in to block the camera when it's done. But by the summer of '02 the media had been so complicit in presenting a good face on Bush [that] his people had started to relax, because they knew that the media would censor themselves. And so, sure enough, on the night when that ran, ''A message to all terrorists!'', everyone had the rest of it and nobody ran it. Because of this implied agreement that we're going to protect each other, Bush feels comfortable enough making a crack like that. [''Now, watch this drive!''] It's like the Marine recruiters that we show? To do that we had to get permission from the Marine Corps. So we called Marine Corps headquarters and I don't even have to get to the point of saying this is Michael Moore's film, because they don't ask. They just assume if media is calling saying they want to film some recruiters doing their job, that it's a positive story.

[b]Did you get the sexual abuse footage before the prison scandal broke?[/b]
Yes.

[b]Why didn't you make it public or give it to the government? [/b]
I thought, What should we do? We don't have a show, we're not going to give it to these networks. They're all cheerleaders for Bush.

[b]You really believe that? [/b]
There's not a single network I would give this footage to and expect them to handle it properly.

[b]But isn't there a chance that you could have stopped this earlier? Don't you have to take that chance?[/b]
It's funny. It's kinda damned if you do, damned if you don't. If I had released this before Cannes, they would have all said that this is a publicity stunt for this movie. And now they're killing me that I waited.

[b]What's the next movie? [/b]
I go after these HMOs and these pharmaceutical companies in the style of ''Run Lola Run.'' I don't know if I can run that fast for hours, but I just thought, What if we were just relentless motherf---ers, because I can't think of anything more evil than these HMOs. We try to see how many lives we can save in 90 minutes.

[b]Ever worry about your tone? This guy IS the President. [/b]
I understand what you're saying. He is the President of the United States. Look, here's a good example of how I feel about this. A couple of weeks ago, out here on Broadway, a guy comes up to me and says, ''I'm a Navy surgeon. And I was on a ship off Iraq the night you made your speech at the Oscars and I was very angry at you. I remember yelling with the others at the screen. Now I just want to apologize. You were right. You were telling the truth.'' And I said, Listen, you don't owe me any apology. Apologize for believing your Commander-in-Chief? The President of the United States? Why feel bad? You SHOULD believe the President, because if we can't believe our President we're in deep trouble. You don't have to apologize. In fact, I want to thank you for offering to risk your life to defend us. I think it would make the founding fathers proud to see the country still survives in their first belief, that's why it's their First Amendment, that somebody has the ability to express themselves and criticize the top guy. That's the country they created. That's the country that gave us Mark Twain, Will Rogers, and Groucho Marx. And that can't be anything but a good thing for America.

[BR]

Good interview. I enjoyed reading it. Thanks Sammy.

[Sammy Sagitarius]

A co-worker is a Moore Whore and he's on some mailing list? He says that the new movie is called "Sicko" or something. I like that he compares it to Lola Rente [sp?].

[Zaquis]

MOMS!?!?

[Bob Toasted]

I think on of the funny things about this threadis that everyone who said they were against Nader couldn't even spell his name right.

[Zaquis]

SHUT UP, BAWB.

[Jaymond]

i saw two nights ago.
great film.
very enjoyable.
and i loved all the footage that the people gave to Moore instead of the American press because they knew they wouldn't show it.

and how funny was it when that lady came in and went "THIS IS A FAKE THIS IS ALL FAKE" and ohhh man. i felt sorry for the lady then.

ouch.

but that other shit lady was a faggot.
The Haunted Mansion is a terrible movie.

[Travis Wells]

Originally posted by Sammy Sagitarius
And, Travis, your mom is stupid. Clinton was an AMAZING PRESIDENT, just an immoral man. When it comes down to the job, the thing we elected him to do, he did it very well. It's America's own fault for CARING about where his dick was that anything ever happened.


That was my point too... eh.

[Andres]

Saw it last night. It was pretty good, though there were a few boring parts.


I have a question, though. I downloaded the movie. Can anyone who downloaded the movie tell me if stuff is missing? Because I don't remember any footage of iraqui children playing, nor do I remember any of the supposed Patriot Act stuff that was supposed to be in the movie.

[Whitey]

The Patriot Act part was when he had that shot of all those blue book things on the table and talked about how most of the people in congress didn't even read over the act before they signed it.

[Andres]

Any idea of where in the movie?

Like, first half or second half?

[Whitey]

I really can't remember, but I'm thinking more towards the first half.

[Whitey]

He interviews one guy who is in Congress and he says something like "I'm going to let you in on something...we don't read most of the bills that come through. We just don't have the time."

That's probably the most memorable part of the Patriot Act section, because you're sitting there thinking "Wait....they don't read the bills? Isn't that sort of...uhh...THEIR JOB?"

[Damage Jackal]

Sorry to bring up a six day old thread, but it is a megathread, and I've gotta give my opinion.
This movie was excellent and terrifiying. The fact that such blatant conflicts of interest can exist in the most powerful regime in the world scares the living hell out of me. I don't understand how the American political system, which prides itself on checks and balances can allow such occurences. It just doesn't make sense to me. Another thing I don't understand about the American political system: How do you get a Senate place in the states? Are you elected, or do you get it passed down to you? Because it seems to me that any elected Senator that felt any sense of responsibilty to their constituency would have signed that bill.

Anyway, about the actual movie. I thought it was done quite well. The first two minutes after the opening credits were extremely intense. Both my girlfriend and I were sitting their crying, at first without even realising it. Sound gets to me so much more than visuals do. And, on that note, I thought Moore's use of music was excellent at some points, particularly the use of Fire Water Burn. That was clever.

Some things did frustrate me though, like the Coalition of the Willing part. He mentioned all those small countries, but neglected to mention England, Australia, Spain, etc, that all joined the coalition, and do have armies. Also, the bit with Bush on the golf course was frustrating, because that's not necessarily showing Bush to be a slacker, or whatever intention Moore was trying to get across. That's actually a standard publicity ploy, that kind of informal meeting of journalists and president, and it was the kind of thing that John F. Kennedy would be hailed as a PR genius if he did. That's something that really annoys me about Moore. He twists information, he leaves parts out. It makes him very hard to use in an argument, even though he's very convincing.

Overall, though, the movie was good. Scary as hell, but good.

[Brix]

http://mitglied.lycos.de/jondanko/sound/stop.wav

[Zaquis]

Hahaha.

[Deano]

WAIT WAIT I didn't post my opinion bitches..

I didn't get much out of this movie because basically I knew most of the stuff he said (Except for the finer details)

But the emotional parts got a little too biased I think.
like when he showed footage of the soldiers and them talking about music (The fire water burn part) Moore took this footage off another movie that documented the soldier's personal lives in Iraq and their musical interests. The director of this film says that he portrays them as very articulate and talented men, but Moore took the worst footage from the film to make them all look like assholes.

yeah it's all been said in this thread

I much enjoyed Moore's anti corporate films more than his anti political ones.

[Hamish Gavin]

I personally think it was a brilliant tactic to make sure Bush doesn't get re-elected and also a very entertaining and important peice of documentation. I also feel that it will make sure that in the future the lines will not blur and people will not think that George W. Bush was a good president. Something like this is what previous events are lacking.

[Sammy Sagitarius]

Politik.