Iraq N Shit [Archive]

Skitch

05-12-04, 08:48 PM

Originally posted by Scatterbrain
Not really, Jeremy...I'm not referring to the video being discussed. I'm talking about this whole problem in Iraq in general, I think this whole decapitation on film is fucking sick. But back to the point i was making, do you guys not see the shit that's going on in Iraq on the news over there? There's riots, hostage takings, gun battles, etc. all over the goddamn place and the British and Americans Forces are losing control...

This my friends, is exactly what the media does to gullible idiots with low I.Qs.

P.S. You're an idiot.

Edit: oops, should've read the rest of the replies before I replied since they said the same thing.

Zaquis

05-12-04, 08:52 PM

If irony were alcohol, we'd all be wasted right now.

Yossarko

05-12-04, 08:55 PM

That's ironic, I really AM wasted right now...

(lol)

Zaquis

05-12-04, 08:56 PM

ME TOO.

OMG PARADOX?

Andres

05-12-04, 08:59 PM

Originally posted by Jeremy Dick
Basically, in a nutshell, Iraq is getting PWNED.

After a year, NO ONE should be getting "PWNED", let alone the country that's supposedly seeking liberation.

Yossarko

05-12-04, 09:00 PM

Exactly. All this bullshit, americans torturing iraqis, iraqis beheading americans, it's fucked up. Not very civil IMHO (and it IS quite humble)

Zaquis

05-12-04, 09:01 PM

If I were a US soldier, every time I shot an Iraqi terrorist I'd scream "PWNED!!!! BITCH!!!!" and I'd also give a motivational speech to my fellow comrades, and I'd end it with, "Let's pwn these motherfuckers! ON WITH THE PWNING!!!" and they'd be like "YEAAAH!" and toss their guns into the air and huzzah and stuff. It'd be so cool.

Yossarko

05-12-04, 09:23 PM

How do you say PWN? I say "Pawned" and think it sounds the best that way. Saying "Powned" just sounds fucking gay.

Anyway: *saves video to masturbation folder*

Zaquis

05-12-04, 09:28 PM

Yeah, I say something like "pawned" but with a lot less "a". Almost like "pwinned"

Kunio

05-12-04, 09:31 PM

Each time I had to move to a different place, I would get a tape recorder to play "MORANGOS COM AÇUCAR!!! DUUUN!!!!" at the departure and arrival at every place.

Evan

05-12-04, 09:54 PM

That video is fucking horrible...
god..

Ben Williams

05-12-04, 10:04 PM

Whatever the real reasons for entering into Iraq were, they have succeeded in nothing but creating a little patch of hell on earth.

Robert Domke

05-12-04, 10:38 PM

Originally posted by Dave Miles
But this one, after the iraqi said a little speech, he walked up to the POW and pulled out a huge blade and puts it to the guys neck

Correction, it wasnt an IRAQI, it was a Jordanian militant with ties to al-Qaida. The al-Qaida had no significant presence in Iraq before the U.S invaded the country....ya know

Evan

05-12-04, 10:47 PM

waits for *saves to masturbation folder* joke.

Allergic 2 Life

05-12-04, 10:53 PM

I watched it, poor quality, you can't really tell when they start cutting off his head. It takes them awhile...

I hope that noise whens its like "ARRRRRRAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGACCCCKKKK" isn't when they start cutting off his head.

That's so brutal, I hate watching that stuff, cause it's real.

Space Goat

05-12-04, 11:12 PM

If I were a solider in Iraq, I'd like to shout things over the radio like;

"Our chefs can't hold them!"
"We've lost contact with an outpost!"
"Requesting a pickup!"
"Enemy submarine spotted!"
"Negative, Negative, Negative, Negative, Negative!!!!!"

Demented Ferret

05-12-04, 11:12 PM

Hahaha - I'd so do that, I'm serious.

Jeremy Dick

05-12-04, 11:21 PM

Originally posted by Andres De La Hoz

After a year, NO ONE should be getting "PWNED", let alone the country that's supposedly seeking liberation.

What I meant was that US is definately 'winning' the war. Not very many American troops are getting killed compared to how many Iraqi idiots are. Several hundred Iraqis are getting killed for every one American, so, in '1337' terms, I believe you could possibly consider that getting 'pwned'.

Jason Nelson

05-12-04, 11:25 PM

Originally posted by Dave Miles
ugh god dude. that was the worst thing ever.

Demented Ferret

05-12-04, 11:26 PM

Oh...So you don't think making an animated gif of it with a [snd2] of the benny hill theme tune will be in order then?

Jason Nelson

05-12-04, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by Mark Veldhuizen
How do you say PWN? I say "Pawned" and think it sounds the best that way. Saying "Powned" just sounds fucking gay.

Anyway: *saves video to masturbation folder*

obviously it's simply 'Powned'. As in owned with a P sound in front of it.

Demented Ferret

05-12-04, 11:28 PM

Nah, Marks right...

Jeremy Dick

05-12-04, 11:33 PM

Originally posted by Jason Nelson

obviously it's simply 'Powned'. As in owned with a P sound in front of it.

that's how i say it too, guess me and jason are weird

Demented Ferret

05-12-04, 11:35 PM

Well, I know people who say it as 'pooned'...So I guess not.

Yossarko

05-12-04, 11:35 PM

There is [obviously] no one way of saying it, it isn't a fucking word. It's missing a vowel.

For me, I forget it comes from OWN. It's a totally different word, and when I look at "PWN" the first word that comes to mind is "PAWN" and actually saying "I pawned him good" is funny, it's like, you took his pawn in a game of chess or something.

Saying "I powned him!" makes you sound like a fucking retard who tried to call someone but has trouble prouncing certain letters.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 12:16 AM

I think it's only fair we let all our male gay US black prisoners rape sadaam in the poohole on live tv and broadcast it to Iraq. See how US handles them killing our people. FUH.

Snatch

05-13-04, 12:36 AM

To my surprise I actually watched the video...and it was awful (obviously)! I wonder if he knew he was going to die, he just sat there in what looked like a daze. If that was myself in the situation I know after they pulled that knife out I would of least squirmed or tried to pull away....maybe I missed that though. He just seemed a little to calm for the situation. Let's hope the reason for that was they had pumped him full of drugs.

Things like that make me sad....

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 12:42 AM

Let's hope the entire middle east and everyone in it get's genocided to extinction.

Snatch

05-13-04, 12:44 AM

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
Let's hope the entire middle east and everyone in it get's genocided to extinction.

Agreed.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 02:38 AM

Let's hope all redneck fucking morons get some simple fucking human decency and stop saying such stupid statements.

Born Zealot

05-13-04, 02:38 AM

Agreed, and I'm an American too.

KC Vikander

05-13-04, 02:47 AM

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
Let's hope the entire middle east and everyone in it get's genocided to extinction.

Wow. Just. Wow.

I can't even comment on such ignorance.

Jason Nelson

05-13-04, 02:51 AM

Originally posted by Cal Flavell
Let's hope all redneck fucking morons get some simple fucking human decency and stop saying such stupid statements.

Yes because they certainly value human life. They should all be destroyed.

KC Vikander

05-13-04, 02:57 AM

I hope you're having fun stereotyping every middle eastern person as a terrorist who doesn't value human life.

The level of ignorance in this thread is baffling.

Snatch

05-13-04, 02:58 AM

Originally posted by Snatch

Agreed.

takes back initial 'Agreed' comment

I don't really believe that's the answer to this sort of problem, I just hope those people that did that to that poor guy get what they deserve.

And no this is not a quick answer change so people like me this is more of a thought through response rather than before.

Damage Jackal

05-13-04, 03:14 AM

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
Let's hope the entire middle east and everyone in it get's genocided to extinction. man, i hope you're joking. if not, you're a redneck moron who knows nothing about world politics. or anything at all.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 04:26 AM

I was joking. But not about the sadaam thing...

And Cal, I hope nothing you said in that last post was reffered towards me.

Greg Aronov

05-13-04, 04:30 AM

I actually really do hope the entire middle east gets genocided to extinction.

That'd be kinda funny.

Jason Nelson

05-13-04, 04:37 AM

I just think they've had it coming for ages.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 04:37 AM

and in all seriousness. If I were running the show. Here would be my goals

Americans, Bushians, every one of you that's on Iraqi garbage soil, or anywhere in the middle east. Hang bush, shoot sadaam. Execute all the prisoners as a lesson for thinking you can treat our prisoners like that. Ban any middle eastern from US soil forever. Goodnight.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 04:39 AM

Originally posted by Damage Jackal
man, i hope you're joking. if not, you're a redneck moron who knows nothing about world politics. or anything at all.

so would that make every australia a redneck moron?

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 04:42 AM

Originally posted by Ramza Brave

so would that make every australia a redneck moron?

And reguarding this. You guys can sit from afar and speculate on everything and get the nerve to say stupid fucking shit about being a redneck. You guys arn't getting attacked by terrorists or even feeling this war. I believe everyone's entitled to their own opinion, but labeling someone who's lost friends from terrorist shit a redneck moron becuase he's angered at these prehistoric stone aged carpet riding baboons for killing innocent civilians, fuck you.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 04:48 AM

damn. Most of you are gone already. Ramble cont:

Here's my reasoning. Terrorism is the most pathetic weak though out dishonorable shit to ever hit man kind. That is no way to make a stand. I mean, if they were to kill congress, attack any political leader, even kill the president. I wouldn't care. They are all fucking morons, and THEY are making these calls. Not the american citizens. Meanwhile, Johny Babaganoush Sand Nigger is cutting off heads of civilians. UNARMED MEN. We are playing around with their prisoners, we arn't slowly dismembering them. So fuck them, fuck what they stand for. Fuck their entire race. If you think I'm a redneck moron, I think you're a censored little pussy fuck that hasn't had a taste of the real world. And hey that's life, and that's the fucking truth.

Damage Jackal

05-13-04, 04:52 AM

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
so would that make every australia a redneck moron? dude, there's only one australia. and i'm pretty damn sure that i know more about world politics than you.

also: if you think that america has never committed what could be considered an act of terrorism, you're a much bigger moron than i originally thought.

Greg Aronov

05-13-04, 04:53 AM

To be honest with you, I just really hate niggers.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 04:54 AM

I never said that did I? And no, I'm not a moron at all. You can choke that down. America, as well as every single place on this earth. Has done sadistical, discusting things. They happen, but they arn't left alone. The shit that happens here, usually happens to itself. IE terrorism for money, ect. And I strongly doubt you know more considering you're like 3 years younger than me?

Greg Aronov

05-13-04, 04:58 AM

Lemme tell you something about Mexicans.

They're filthy.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 04:58 AM

Damn right. You're on a role tonight.

Gorosaurus

05-13-04, 05:02 AM

HEY GUYS WANNA PLAY THIS CRAZY ROLL PLAYING GAME?

IT'S CALLED YAHTZEE

Damage Jackal

05-13-04, 05:03 AM

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
I never said that did I? And no, I'm not a moron at all. You can choke that down. America, as well as every single place on this earth. Has done sadistical, discusting things. They happen, but they arn't left alone. The shit that happens here, usually happens to itself. IE terrorism for money, ect. And I strongly doubt you know more considering you're like 3 years younger than me? try a year and a half, dipshit. and i study politics.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 05:05 AM

that's great you toothless imbred sack of dicks. I minored WORLD HISTORY.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 05:12 AM

I really can't say anything that hasn't been said already.

As a Salvationist I'm opposed to the war on principle, but as a person with politics, well I'm still opposed. George Bush has perverted the scriptures and is calling this is God given duty. The Bible does give justifications for time of war. St. Augustine also had his 7 basic principles in 1611. What bugs me is that George Bush recited thos 7 reasons verbatim. That tells me that it's not because he truly believes it, but because he wanted the Christians on his side. Thing is, we have now learned that there was no direct threat to us and second no one is any free-er than they were 2 years ago. And the Oil Ministry is still the most heavily guarded place in Baghdad.

Ramza, you and I agree on George Bush. I just plumb don't like the guy. Some people say history is a BS degree with no real value. I salute you for pursuing it, because in researching history I have developed a better understanding of the world today and have a good idea of what the future will bring.

Whoever you are, wherever you are, I hope you find peace wherever you may look for it.

Damage Jackal

05-13-04, 05:14 AM

thread turns into a damien jasper bashing thread

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 05:17 AM

I'll tell you that all this leaves a rotten taste in my mouth. These people are nuts, just wait till they get ahold of some sort of nuclear detonator. Then the real sparks will fly. And my little joke about genocide, just might become a reality. The whole thing is just getting worse by the second. Something needs to happen. I'm out.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 05:18 AM

Why's it have to do that? I was just giving my input like everyone else. I haven't insulted anybody. I figured this topic was going to come up eventually, especially with the pictures controversy. Bash me if you want, but I'm hoping most everyone else sticks to the subject at hand. What crawled up your @$$ anyway?

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 05:19 AM

I'm actually glad Jasper saw this thread. I was going to pm him to ask him what he thought on it. I read his other topic about fuel, and liked him a bit more.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 05:21 AM

I'd like to have a discussion with you about the same thing Ramza.

We're all involved in this you guys, like it or not.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 05:26 AM

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
I was joking. But not about the sadaam thing...

And Cal, I hope nothing you said in that last post was reffered towards me.

I kinda guessed you'd be at least slightly joking. I was mainly aiming it at Snatch, and now Jason Nelson, too. And I don't agree whatsoever with your "no Middle Eastern person should be allowed in America" crack. That's just fucked up.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 05:31 AM

How goes it, Cal?

This is for the religious and the religious only on this board. So you have been forewarned so I don't want to hear about "forcing it" on anyone or that I "tricked" people into seeing this. This is something I've been reading that puts life in perspective for those who are versed in the scriptures and prophecies of things to come. FOR BELIEVERS ONLY

http://www.raptureready.com/

I recommend the FAQ section, because there's lots of insight there. Don't say I didn't warn you. By the way, I AM NOT A JEHOVA'S WITNESS in case you were wondering by the link.

Jason Nelson

05-13-04, 05:35 AM

Originally posted by Cal Flavell

I kinda guessed you'd be at least slightly joking. I was mainly aiming it at Snatch, and now Jason Nelson, too. And I don't agree whatsoever with your "no Middle Eastern person should be allowed in America" crack. That's just fucked up.

Sorry it's just I was absolutely repulsed by that video. For awhile it made me hate all muslims, then I realized that it's not all muslims. But hey, it's a fair number. There just way to ruthless. They bitch about how the Americans treat their prisoners after they drag soldiers down a street and hang their bodies off bridges? Sorry it's just alot of hypocricy. And another thing, they could've fucking actually CUT off his head and not sawed it off for 30 seconds. You can see his mouth opening to scream but they cut his vocal chords. It's a fucking disgrace to mankind.

Gorosaurus

05-13-04, 05:38 AM

EDIT: Removed random comment to try and keep it to a 1-per-page maximum. My next one actually had some context, if one looks for it.

Which would mean that I wouldn't really have to remove this one, but... yeah. Storch forced me to.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 05:42 AM

I'm so glad I didn't watch that video. My Lord, what's wrong with these people? I understand their viewpoint to a degree actually. I even understand WHY Osama Bin Laden attacked on 9/11 although I can't condone it. But the problem is, these people aren't 'just doing it'. This is something their religion condones.

Before you jump on me saying Christianity condones it too, I'll explain something: Genesis says "Life for a life" then Jesus says "I'm here to fulfill the laws". Therefore, when he died on the cross, he WAS that given life so retaliatory murder no longer holds in the New Covenant. Anyone well versed in Christian religion would know that. I'm not pushing this on you guys, I'm just saying. I'll not reply to any replies made to this part of my response because I'm tired of debating my religion. If you disagree with me, just say it and move on and let's stick to the issue.

I just have to know you guys: How could you bring yourselves to watch that video. I stopped once they threw him to the ground cause I couldn't take it. Now, my problem is EXTREME empathy. God gave me a very, very soft heart. I hate to think that you guys enjoy watching that stuff, but please don't tell me it was easy. Maybe you were just made of sterner stuff than I was.

Take care everyone.

Dave Miles

05-13-04, 05:44 AM

I SAY WE TAKE THIS DEBATE TO THE NEXT LEVEL, BOYS. MY VIEWS? WELL, I THINK I SPEAK FOR EVERYONE WHEN I SAY BUSH DID IT FOR THE OIL. AND WHERE ARE THESE WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION, BUSH? HUH? WHERE THE FUCK ARE THEY. OH YEAH THAT'S RIGHT, THERE AREN'T ANY. GET THE FUCK OUT, FAGGOT.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 05:45 AM

Originally posted by Dave Miles
I SAY WE TAKE THIS DEBATE TO THE NEXT LEVEL, BOYS. MY VIEWS? WELL, I THINK I SPEAK FOR EVERYONE WHEN I SAY BUSH DID IT FOR THE OIL. AND WHERE ARE THESE WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION, BUSH? HUH? WHERE THE FUCK ARE THEY. OH YEAH THAT'S RIGHT, THERE AREN'T ANY. GET THE FUCK OUT, FAGGOT.

Thank you Dave. I've just been too concerned with my manners to say that. You are right. I'm glad you were able to get out and say it. This goes hand in hand with my Oil post. See the awful things dependency has already done? Who looks to the future and does not weep?

Gorosaurus

05-13-04, 05:45 AM

And there stands Jackson, standing like a stone wall.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 05:46 AM

Damien, I've been to the site many times, usually to peruse the forums and laugh my ass off. Many - not all, but many, and you have to at least admit this - of the people there are absolute backwoods hillbilly morons. Honestly, some of them are troglodytes who would require somebody to read the Bible out to them because they couldn't read a fucking McDonalds menu.

http://users.rcn.com/rostmd/winace/fundies/

Now that is a great site.

Jason - I was repulsed by it, too. But it didn't make me hate any certain group. The actions of a few don't dictate the views of a whole race. I mean, did the Timothy McVeigh's actions in the Oklahoma City bombings or Harris and Klebold's actions in Columbine make you hate all white people? No, of course not.

One of the most famous film clips on the internet is a Russian soldier being stabbed in the neck and beheaded by a group of Chechyan rebels. It's almost exactly the same as the Nick Berg film, but it didn't make me hate each and every Chechnyan. Saying such broad, hate-filled things as "every Muslim must die" is what causes extremism. Don't let yourself sink to the level of the people who support the act.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 05:47 AM

Cal, you are of course right. But I have conversed with the webmaster and he's very well educated. Cal, is that to say you've read the Bible and were able to find an understanding with it? These sort of people is why "The Living Bible" and "New International Version" were published. But I certainly hope you're not implying that I'm some kind of inbred halfwit because I'd hate to argue with you.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 05:51 AM

Originally posted by Jason Nelson

Sorry it's just I was absolutely repulsed by that video. For awhile it made me hate all muslims, then I realized that it's not all muslims. But hey, it's a fair number. There just way to ruthless. They bitch about how the Americans treat their prisoners after they drag soldiers down a street and hang their bodies off bridges? Sorry it's just alot of hypocricy.

The people who got cut to pieces and dragged down the street weren't US soldiers, they were mercenaries working for an American security country. That company (I've forgotten the name now, something like Blackburn or something) pays mercenaries a LOT of money to go over and act as a secondary militia for the US army. Those guys were getting paid a lot more than Americans and knew the risks, and since they weren't soldiers, then they weren't treated as POWs. You keep forgetting, the rebel militia isn't a formal army and this isn't a time of war. The was was declared over by YOUR president, and since these aren't official Iraqi soldiers, they don't follow the Geneva conventions. So I don't see why you're comparing them to US soldiers, who actually broke their own rules.

Originally posted by Jason Nelson
And another thing, they could've fucking actually CUT off his head and not sawed it off for 30 seconds. You can see his mouth opening to scream but they cut his vocal chords. It's a fucking disgrace to mankind.

Yeah, trust me, the aforementioned film clip of the Russian getting his head sawed off is basically exactly the same, only last a lot longer and is a close up. And the sound is a lot more disturbing. I saw it most recently a fortnight ago at Cliffmosher's place. Thankfully I was too drunk at the time to be disgusted by it.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 05:53 AM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
Cal, you are of course right. But I have conversed with the webmaster and he's very well educated. Cal, is that to say you've read the Bible and were able to find an understanding with it? These sort of people is why "The Living Bible" and "New International Version" were published. But I certainly hope you're not implying that I'm some kind of inbred halfwit because I'd hate to argue with you.

No, I'm not. I'm just saying, if you're going to put forth a site as a source of enlightenment of wisdom, you must at least admit that many of the people there are exactly the opposite. People speak all of the time about Muslim fundamentalism, but fail to see that many of the people who put their two cents in on the internet are Christian fundamentalists - ie the Christians who claim that Muslims are Satan worshippers and that they should all be killed in the name of God.

Also, I have read the Bible, or at least many parts of it. But I was a child, and didn't appreciate it. I don't doubt it's an informative collection of morality tales but I don't agree with the way it's message is given.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 05:57 AM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
I'm so glad I didn't watch that video. My Lord, what's wrong with these people? I understand their viewpoint to a degree actually. I even understand WHY Osama Bin Laden attacked on 9/11 although I can't condone it. But the problem is, these people aren't 'just doing it'. This is something their religion condones.

This is where you're wrong.

1. The Koran (I know it's traditionally spelled Q'uran or something, but I can't be bothered double-checking it) does not say, ANYWHERE, that murder is justified. Like the Taliban, hardline Muslim fundamentalists simply choose to interpret it that way. If you actually spoke to Muslims (which I do quite often, as there are many in my university course), you'd see that most of them agree that the Koran does not promote or allow violence. Fanatics just twist it suit their goals.

2. "What's wrong with these people?" The same thing that's wrong with Christians who bomb abortion clinics: they're nuts.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 06:00 AM

Cal, you are right about something. Some people get so lost in their passion for Christianity the religion that the meaning of it gets swept away. I'm not offering the sight as a source of enlightenment, just a good study guide. Actually, I think the only useful part about the site is the FAQ. I don't consider Muslims to be Satan worshippers. However, I do believe they worship a false God. If I explain my reasons, I'll just open up the Pandora's Box again and me and Andres will be at it once more and I don't want that. So from here on out I'm willing to drop the religious topic and go back to the War intself.

I do understand your point about Christians who bomb abortion clinics. I suppose I was wrong about Muslims. However, I do know one thing for sure. Mohommad himself said "Convert by the Sword if necessary" That's something Jesus never said and if it did (which it did) happen in history, it's because people perverted the teachings (which we are taught will happen). So just like the Muslims you know who don't represent terrorists, remember that I and many other Christians shouldn't be categorized with Christian terrorists. We can agree to disagree on everything else.

Latermuch.

PS: Troglodyte. Good word usage! Try using Liturgical in a sentence tomorrow!

Jason Nelson

05-13-04, 06:01 AM

See that's just it Cal. I hate the Muslim society for a reason. Alls I hear on the news is how they're constantly killing somebody. They're constantly fighting and killing all throughout the middle east. That's what sparked me to hate them so much. And the thing that gets me, is they figure they're holy. Murdering hundreds of your countrymen is holy? Well fuck the middle east. The US should've just let it rot.

Bravoie

05-13-04, 06:01 AM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
I understand their viewpoint to a degree actually. I even understand WHY Osama Bin Laden attacked on 9/11 although I can't condone it.

...:rolleyes

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 06:03 AM

If you got something to say shagz, say it. I'll be happy to debate it with you. Like I said, I don't condone it. However he is at heart a Muslim nationalist. That's his cracked brain in a nutshell.

Gorosaurus

05-13-04, 06:06 AM

Originally posted by Jason Nelson
See that's just it Cal. I hate the Muslim society for a reason. Alls I hear on the news is how they're constantly killing somebody. They're constantly fighting and killing all throughout the middle east. That's what sparked me to hate them so much. And the thing that gets me, is they figure they're holy. Murdering hundreds of your countrymen is holy? Well fuck the middle east. The US should've just let it rot.

Think of the Middle East as a foot, or a leg of the body. You let it rot, and it'll definitely affect the rest of you, even if not totally directly. I wish it weren't so, but it is.

PS: Troglodyte. Good word usage! Try using Liturgical in a sentence tomorrow!

A lot of people have used troglodyte, esp. since it was used in the same way in Spielburg's The Lost World. I think it's almost commonplace, actually

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 06:09 AM

Damien, I don't categorize you with terrorists. Or even fundamentalists. I just see you as faithful to your religion, nothing more, nothing less.

Jason, you talked about "what you hear on the news". Well, ever considered that the media is biased?

Personally, I contradict myself sometimes. I support Israel over Palestine, yet I accept that the only reason the US supports Israel is to get a foothold in the region, which is fairly unjust. So I'm at a loss there.

The best thing for the middle east right now would be a stable (non-theocratic) government in Iran, the US pulling out of Iraq, and a peace treaty between Israel and Palestine. Sharon is pulling out settlements from one part of Gaza, but that's not enough right now. There needs to be a stable ceasefire which involves Arafat calming down Hamas and the PLO for a while.

People need to start turning their attention towards Africa; it's getting far worse there than in the middle east. Militia death squads there are raping, killing and pillaging far more than the militia in the middle east, and the AIDS virus is rampant (owing to the fact that many people there mistakenly believe that HIV can be cured by having sex with a virgin girl).

If America really cared about people rather than profit, they'd be stomping out Robert Mugabe's regime in Zimbabwe, or helping lower the crime rate in South Africa (the crime capital of the world).

Greg Aronov

05-13-04, 06:14 AM

Back to the topic of niggers:

Why the fuck are they so brown?

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 06:15 AM

Cal, you bring up a valid point (and continue to be the most sensible person on this board). Africa has been a rotting cesspool of human failure for longer than I can remember. That is as tragic as tragic gets, I can't say that with enough hyperbole. However, it is more important to the globe that the Mid East be top priority. Africa has no danger of destroying the entire planet because of their wars, the Middle east does. It's just the hotbed that End Timers can point to, with good reason. All the crazies over there with nuclear ambition and access and the desire to do so. While I think Africa is the tragedy of human tragedy, I also think it's a lost cause. But as a Salvation Army soldier, I vowed to go wherever I may be sent, even if there is no hope.

So before people cut on how awful the "civilized world" or "western world" (US, Canada, Japan, Western Europe and Australia) is, they should look beyond those borders and see that it don't get much better than what we have.

Sometimes I consider the offer that the nearest Amish community extended to me (in Montana). I'd rather spend the end times with those who understand. But maybe that's just hiding. I don't know.

Latermuch.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 06:15 AM

Greg: because they evolved with a skin pigmentation that protects them from most ultraviolet radiation. Thus they are generally safe from skin cancers, and are ideally suited to living in an equatorial climate.

Greg Aronov

05-13-04, 06:16 AM

I...

yeah but...

niggers.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 06:17 AM

Cal, you would make a great college professor!

Bravoie

05-13-04, 06:17 AM

Damien, there is no logical reason as to why Osama carried out the 911 attacks. PERIOD.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 06:19 AM

Damien - nah, I'd have to be far more boring. At least, judging by how easily my lecturers put me to sleep.

Originally posted by shagz2dope
Damien, there is no logical reason as to why Osama carried out the 911 attacks. PERIOD.

Way to go, Mister CNN.

Actually, there are many, many reasons. None that justified murder on a mass scale, but at least reasons that were good enough for them. Nobody sacrifices their life for nothing. I mean, it's not like they sat in a cave going "hey, if we crash some planes into buildings in the name of our god, wouldn't it be cool?"

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 06:21 AM

I don't have time for this. But lemme tell you something, someone doesn't just up and decide to do that. It wasn't out of "jealousy" for our power. People who say that assume that everyone in the world shares the same values as us, that is material and military power, and that's not true. Look back at the behavior of the US in the Middle East: the horrible dictators they've proped up and the coups they've organized. That's what pissed him off. See, if Saddam was such an AWFUL person, what does that say about the US in backing him? See, Osama and Saddam were enemies as well. The friend of Osama's enemy is Osama's enemy as well. See what I'm getting at?

What is extremely ironic about all of this is that a vast majority of Americans and Arabs would like nothing better than to live in peace with each other. You think we LIKE hating one another? But things have gotten far too out of control for anyone but God to repair now.

Latermuch and thanks for the input.

Bravoie

05-13-04, 06:23 AM

Note that I said LOGICAL reasons. Logical to normal people like us, not nuts like the terrorists.

Gorosaurus

05-13-04, 06:26 AM

General William Tecumseh Sherman would've been considered a terrorist at large had the Union not of won the American Civil War

EDIT: He's the one who salted almost all of Georgia's farms, and devastated Atlanta/whatever else got in his way. You see, the terrorists realize that it is the boldest men of the winning side that will become the heroes once the smoke settles.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 06:26 AM

Damien, that's a very good post, and very true.

At one time or another, America has supported Palestine, Israel, Iraq, Iran, and the Afghani rebels who eventually became the Taliban (including Osama bin Laden).

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 06:28 AM

Personally, I think I presented a logical train of thought. Saddam committed atrocities on Muslims because they were Muslims with weapons and financial support of the US. Osama is DEEPLY Muslim. Saddam is only one case as well.

Of course, it takes someone of a certain insanity to express their rage the way he did. That is a given of course, I won't fight you on that.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 06:28 AM

Originally posted by shagz2dope
Note that I said LOGICAL reasons. Logical to normal people like us, not nuts like the terrorists.

Well logic is a relative concept - what's logic to one person isn't logical to another - so you can't really comment. Their reasons are their own and no matter how crazy it is to us, it's still a reason.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 06:31 AM

No kidding, Cal. You put it very astutely when you said that they didn't just sit around in a cave and dream it up. They have reasons to be as pissed as they are. Mid East anger and turmoil doesn't just merely exist the way air does. It has its roots and reasons like all things human.

Damage Jackal

05-13-04, 07:09 AM

Originally posted by Jason Nelson
Alls I hear on the news is how they're constantly killing somebody. They're constantly fighting and killing all throughout the middle east.do you understand media? do you think cnn is going to open their bulletins with 'nothing is happening tonight in the middle east. at all. nothing. it's quiet and peaceful.'? no. they're after a shock story, the gory shit.

Originally posted by Cal Flavell
Damien, that's a very good post, and very true.

At one time or another, America has supported Palestine, Israel, Iraq, Iran, and the Afghani rebels who eventually became the Taliban (including Osama bin Laden). i think they were called the 'moujaheedin.' i can't remember the exact spelling. and while we're on brutal regimes that the cia has propped up, why not throw guatemala and nicaragua into the mix? haiti? hell, they've dominated south american politics for nearly sixty years.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 09:20 AM

Yeah, I was gonna call them the mujaheddin (sp?) but considering I don't know the spelling, I thought it'd kinda dumb down my post, so I didn't refer to them by that.

And yeah, if we got into stuff like Pinochet or Noriega, we'd be in here for hours.

Hamish Gavin

05-13-04, 09:26 AM

Jesus christ some of you guys are sick. You actually WATCHED that shit. I mean, I'm all cool with gore, i'm a fucking gore hound but to think of actually watching someone die on camera...

...it's a fucking snuff film.

Fuck this, I'm-a go watch Bad Taste.

Jaymond

05-13-04, 09:49 AM

i just saw the video.

i'm glad i live a sheltered life.

Jason Ruiz

05-13-04, 09:57 AM

http://disasturbation.com/b0cb0ccbf589569d077dc4d210dc01cd.wav

Demented Ferret

05-13-04, 09:57 AM

hahahaha...

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 10:13 AM

Originally posted by Hamish Gavin
Jesus christ some of you guys are sick. You actually WATCHED that shit. I mean, I'm all cool with gore, i'm a fucking gore hound but to think of actually watching someone die on camera...

...it's a fucking snuff film.

Dude, you need to wake up to the world. I had tutors at university today telling me they'd seen it, and my entire Computer Systems 1 class ended up discussing what snuff films we'd seen... then again they're a lot like the members of this board, eh.

Damage Jackal

05-13-04, 11:38 AM

yeah, dude. you're probably gonna see a dead body once in your life. you don't have to like it, but you don't have to be a faggot.

Yossarko

05-13-04, 12:39 PM

http://yossarko.free.fr/iraq.wmv

A mirror. Yes.

Bravoie

05-13-04, 02:29 PM

Bottom line, the middle east will always find some "reason" or "excuse" to hate us. And because all they know is violence, they will continue to plan attacks. After the current terrorist groups have ceased, new ones will be formed and new Osama's will pop up.

KC Vikander

05-13-04, 02:46 PM

Originally posted by Jason Nelson
See that's just it Cal. I hate the Muslim society for a reason. Alls I hear on the news is how they're constantly killing somebody. They're constantly fighting and killing all throughout the middle east. That's what sparked me to hate them so much. And the thing that gets me, is they figure they're holy. Murdering hundreds of your countrymen is holy? Well fuck the middle east. The US should've just let it rot.

That's like saying "oh, the only news I hear of black people is that they're in gangs and shit, and they steal and kill"

Stereotyping is the biggest sign of ignorance.

Robert Domke

05-13-04, 02:53 PM

Originally posted by shagz2dope
Bottom line, the middle east will always find some "reason" or "excuse" to hate us.

The reason is, because the US initiated this war on their soil, without provocation, of course they are mad. You have to look at what started it. Cause and effect

Bravoie

05-13-04, 03:12 PM

It doesn't matter what the reason is. It doesn't justify what they do. They'll continue doing these attacks because THEY ARE INSANE. That's right, I said it, INSANE.

Robert Domke

05-13-04, 03:40 PM

Originally posted by shagz2dope
It doesn't matter what the reason is. It doesn't justify what they do. They'll continue doing these attacks because THEY ARE INSANE. That's right, I said it, INSANE.

Meanwhile American soldiers continue to torture, rape and kill innocent Iraqi civillians. There is no justification for this behaviour either

Bravoie

05-13-04, 04:06 PM

Please show me anything actually PROOVING American soldiers raping & torturing Iraqi civillians.

Robert Domke

05-13-04, 05:00 PM

Originally posted by shagz2dope
Please show me anything actually PROOVING American soldiers raping & torturing Iraqi civillians.

:rolleyes

Domicile Destructo

05-13-04, 06:20 PM

Dude, best video ever.

Scatterbrain

05-13-04, 06:55 PM

Well, having read the numerous replies to what I posted perfectly within my own right, I am not impressed. Everyone's entitled to their own take on something, and simply because I don't think going around saying "Yeah, kill those fucking Iraqis, yeah they deserve it. That's it! Let's cheer on two nations' armed forces still fighting a year after this poxy war was officially declared over and losing more people now than they were then!" I really don't think that all of a sudden makes me fresh meat for you fucking Americans. It appears that simply because I'm not on your fucking level, I am a "Gullible Idiot with no IQ". How so? It's a fucking sham!

I am perfectly entitled to my opinion on this, and just because I don't hold the same opinion as yours, you immediately jump down my throat. Well up yours, guys. I think you're argument against me is severley flawed. It's nothing to do with media brainwashing, that's what happens over in your country. It's to do with the fact that America and Britain are going on about a June 30th handover date! Well, I think they'd better buck their ideas up, otherwise, they're just going to be

A) Handing over a far-from liberated wasteland to these fucking people, full of rebels, Sadaam loyalists, and people just plain upset about the mess that's been made... or
B) Finding the country is just taken from them by the rebels etc. who will just ruin everything that the 'Coalition' have wasted a year and a half over...

In my opinion, British and American forces are hardly keeping peace and giving their best shot at restoring Iraqi power and helping Iraq get to the position that they should be in. Free of torment, attacks and other such stuff...

I stand by my original comment, which was only a personal opinion which I wasn't forcing anyone to agree and think that this whole handover of power is not going to work, as these rebels and other such maniacs are actually, quite simply, taking it...and I don't care what you pro-war patriots have to say in reply to that...good day to you...

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:05 PM

Originally posted by Mark Veldhuizen
americans torturing iraqis
That never fucking happened. It's not torture, idiot.

Abuse? Yes. Those guys were assholes, and what they did was probably unnecessary, but they aren't going around CUTTING HEADS OFF.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by Robert Domke
Meanwhile American soldiers continue to torture, rape and kill innocent Iraqi civillians. There is no justification for this behaviour either You're a fucking idiot. Stop making up RETARDED SHIT, or get the fuck out.

Yossarko

05-13-04, 07:18 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski

That never fucking happened. It's not torture, idiot.

Riding around some old lady like a fucking pony? Making arab prisoners MASTURBATE each other? Sexuality is a big thing in the eastern world and for them, that is fucking torture. They were held at GUN POINT.

Robert Domke

05-13-04, 07:19 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski

That never fucking happened. It's not torture, idiot.

Abuse? Yes. Those guys were assholes, and what they did was probably unnecessary, but they aren't going around CUTTING HEADS OFF.

What about the couple dozen that got beaten to death? Or the ones that got raped?

Maybee you should wait for the whole story before you make an ass out of yourself... that is unless you are hinting it would be ok for me to tie you up and put panites on your head. Then I would be cool with you.

Klown

05-13-04, 07:20 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski

That never fucking happened. It's not torture, idiot.

Abuse? Yes. Those guys were assholes, and what they did was probably unnecessary, but they aren't going around CUTTING HEADS OFF. Abuse is so much nicer than torture.

*covers xclexski in ice and wraps him in cellophane before throwing him into a bus*

Gorosaurus

05-13-04, 07:22 PM

Originally posted by Robert Domke

:rolleyes

...Well?

Robert Domke

05-13-04, 07:25 PM

Originally posted by Gorosaurus

...Well?

Well what ? Read a fucking newspaper, if the big werds dont confuse yuo

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:26 PM

Domke just likes making up stuff because he's anti-American.

Cowtacular Spleen

05-13-04, 07:27 PM

http://humournet.co.uk/Images/Funny_pics04/funny_pic85.jpg

Klown

05-13-04, 07:28 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
Domke just likes making up stuff because he's anti-American. LOL NOT TORTURE MORE LIKE EXTREME ABUSE AM I RITE?

Yossarko

05-13-04, 07:28 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
Domke just likes making up stuff because he's anti-American.

And you can't even back up you poor fucking arguments. Boo.

Yossarko

05-13-04, 07:31 PM

Originally posted by Cowtacular Spleen
http://humournet.co.uk/Images/Funny_pics04/funny_pic85.jpg

No. Sorry, but that's so fucking old it has lost any funny it may or may not have once held.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:32 PM

Originally posted by Mark Veldhuizen
And you can't even back up you poor fucking arguments. Boo.
It's kind of hard to have a counter argument to Domke saying that we 'torture, rape and kill innocent Iraqi civillians' because it's fucking OBVIOUS it never happened, and there's nothing that needs to be said to that.

Robert Domke

05-13-04, 07:33 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
Domke just likes making up stuff because he's anti-American.

My god you are retarded.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:33 PM

Originally posted by Crappy Klown
LOL NOT TORTURE MORE LIKE EXTREME ABUSE AM I RITE?
You're an idiot. Get the fuck out now.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 07:35 PM

As far as the camel cartoon goes:

I don't understand why people have hostility toward MIddle Easterners because they live slower and more primitevely. Big deal! What's so great about getting in a big damn hurry about your life anyway? Look where it's gotten the US: An entire third of the population is drugged up on something, 2/3 of the population is overweight and we are so dependent on oil that we can't even conceive of not having it in abundance. You can hate their skin color for all I care, but when people say "Stupid desert dwellers" it just ticks me off.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:36 PM

Originally posted by Robert Domke
My god you are retarded. If there was 'torture, rape and kill innocent Iraqi civillians' by Americans, I think everyone would know about it. The media would have a field day.

But obviously, you know more than anyone else. Either that or you are making up this shit because you're anti-American.

Robert Domke

05-13-04, 07:37 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski

It's kind of hard to have a counter argument to Domke saying that we 'torture, rape and kill innocent Iraqi civillians' because it's fucking OBVIOUS it never happened, and there's nothing that needs to be said to that.

Hey fuckwit, An iternal army investigation has shown systemic abuse, including the death and coverup of some prisoners.

Scatterbrain

05-13-04, 07:38 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
But obviously, you know more than anyone else. Either that or you are making up this shit because you're anti-American.

Considering your arguments and comebacks in this discussion, Xclexski... I'll go for the first option...

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 07:38 PM

Dude, it's a fact that the Pentagon has thousands more pictures than were released. Even our own lawmakers came out saying "This is awful. How did these people get into our army?" There are pictures we HAVEN'T seen because the Pentagon doesn't want us to. I wonder why...

Scatterbrain

05-13-04, 07:40 PM

Edit- Woops!

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:40 PM

Originally posted by Robert Domke
Hey fuckwit, An iternal army investigation has shown systemic abuse, including the death and coverup of some prisoners. Yeah, I know that happened, shitface. They still aren't CIVILIANS, and they aren't INNOCENT.

So when did Americans 'torture, rape and kill innocent Iraqi civillians'? I'm still wondering about this...

Klown

05-13-04, 07:42 PM

http://www.3dmm.net/images/other/torture.jpg
http://www.3dmm.net/images/other/torture2.jpg
http://www.3dmm.net/images/other/torture3.jpg

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 07:42 PM

There's pictures of it that they are debating on releasing as we speak.

Even if there wasn't, what frightens me is if they were willing to take pictures of that disgusting behavior, what awful things might have happened off camera? They showed 1000s of pictures to Congress the other day and one of them was quoted as saying that one of the prisoners "Was forced to sodmoize himself at gunpoint. There was blood in the picture". You don't call THAT torture?

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:43 PM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
There are pictures we HAVEN'T seen because the Pentagon doesn't want us to. I wonder why... Because when the first few were released, an American CIVILIAN got his head CUT OFF.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 07:44 PM

Dammit, read this for pete's sake.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040512/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_prisoner_abuse_46

Now defend it you sicko. You read that right: FORCED SEX. I've never been ashamed of our military until now. How dare they call this a mission from God.

Robert Domke

05-13-04, 07:44 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
...because you're anti-American.

Im more american than you will ever be

Skitch

05-13-04, 07:45 PM

He wasn't saying what they did wasn't wrong. He's pointing out why it's not surprising they want to keep those pictures under wraps for awhile.

(Damien)

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 07:48 PM

I know, but that's because the pictures might just verify what Domke is saying. Maybe under the extreme stress of battle, our soldiers turn out no better than the dogs of war we claim to be above.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:50 PM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
Dammit, read this for pete's sake.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040512/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_prisoner_abuse_46

Now defend it you sicko. You read that right: FORCED SEX. I've never been ashamed of our military until now. How dare they call this a mission from God. I'm not defending it, you fucking douche. I'm saying it's shitty, but it doesn't compare to KILLING PEOPLE. Especially people like NICK BERG, an INNOCENT CIVILIAN.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:52 PM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
I know, but that's because the pictures might just verify what Domke is saying.He's saying that they're 'INNOCENT IRAQI CIVILIANS'.

A LIE.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 07:52 PM

Originally posted by Robert Domke
Im more american than you will ever be
You're a fucking nazi.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 07:59 PM

To assume no civilians have died is perposterous. But I see what you're getting at and I did take it out of context. But I'll wait until the whole story comes out. I refuse to believe civilians haven't been pulled into this. It happened in 'Nam and even tho that's a dirty word right now, this is a lot like it. The soldiers have no clear objective so the solution is to kill everything in sight until you feel like you've accomplished something. Lord, I hate nationalism.

Yossarko

05-13-04, 08:01 PM

You are so fucking blind, Xlclexski. I pity the fool. The fool called X.

Yossarko

05-13-04, 08:03 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
I'm not defending it, you fucking douche. I'm saying it's shitty, but it doesn't compare to KILLING PEOPLE. Especially people like NICK BERG, an INNOCENT CIVILIAN.

Faggot, NO. You said there was no torture. THERE WAS. Also, to arab culture, torture like that is WORSE than execution. Forcing them to wank themselves and each other in front of american soldiers?

I'm not saying it's worse than execution, but it's right up there with it. Now fuck off, you gherkin.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 08:04 PM

Did they not say the murder was in response to the torture? I hope the soldiers who did that are proud of themselves. I'm sure Nick Berg is.

Yossarko

05-13-04, 08:06 PM

It's pretty obvious it was in response to the TORTURE (not execution, damien). That's why they filmed it and hung the head up and stuck it on the internet.

But the american soldiers will just be MORE pissed now and go doing MORE crazy unethical shit. And the tit for tat will continue. It's fucking immature and disgusting (on BOTH sides).

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 08:08 PM

We're in agreement, Mark.

(You're right, I did f-up the word execution. I shoulda said torture. Things are just moving so fast. I'll fix it)

Scatterbrain

05-13-04, 08:12 PM

Can I just ask, what kind of stuff is shown on American telly to do with this whole Iraq thing? (ie. News, Updates, and the like...) Because I personally have one word for News etc. over here, Newsnight I, myself, think they are the last word in news over here. They've covered a heck of a lot to do with this whole ordeal about the abuse or Iraqi Prisoners/Soldiers/Civilians, and what is shown is pretty undeniable. I've been told many times that US Television is under the thumb of The Bush Administration and a lot gets censored, or it at least get censored until it's very late in the evening etc...i dunno...but that's only what I've heard. Please can someone clarrify this for me?

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 08:14 PM

Fox News is the Republican Gospel scatterbrain. They do nothing but show American flags and talk about what a wonderful person George Bush is. Sean Hannity masturbates to his picture I think. Seriously, it's a fact that Fox News is the ONLY news network that's shown in the Halls of DC. So everyone up there is just slapping their willies along with Fox.

The rest of it, I dunno. I suppose we get as much as you do. They say there's a liberal bias in the media but that's BS. Any time the ugly truth about our government is revealed, it's called a left wing conspiracy to weaken the country. But the truth hurts, to liberals and conservatives alike. But someone has to stand up and say it.

KC Vikander

05-13-04, 08:17 PM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
Now defend it you sicko. You read that right: FORCED SEX. I've never been ashamed of our military until now. How dare they call this a mission from God.

Hold the fucking phone.

How dare our military call this a mission from God, when we've treated these prisoners like shit?

So it's okay when a differnet group of people rename "mission from God" to "Jihad" and kill thousands of innocent people in a terrorist attack?

There IS a difference between soldiers and civilians. The bottom line is that it is NOT justified for the group of terrorists who killed, totured even, a normal civilian, just because he was an American. That would be just as logical as for me to go and kill a random Arab just to make up for what happened. There is a difference between civilian and soldier.

I never once said it was okay for American soldiers to do what they are doing to the POWs, but beheading an innocent person to make up for it is even more cold blooded and cruel.

KC Vikander

05-13-04, 08:18 PM

Jasper, are you American?

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 08:20 PM

Lemme get something straight, I don't think God supports terrorism in any way. But we aren't talking about the Arabs right now. We're talking about 'our boys'. The differene is that the media, liberal and conservative alike are telling us that we should all get down and kiss the ass of anyone in uniform. But that don't cut the mustard with me anymore. So I shiver when people say "God bless our troops". I don't think that's what God had in mind.

What does my nationality have to do with anything? Lemme guess, if I don't support the war, I'm a traitor right? God forbid that Free Speech actually mean anything. "We meant free, but not THAT free!"

Scatterbrain

05-13-04, 08:25 PM

Hats off to you, Japser! :)

KC Vikander

05-13-04, 08:27 PM

I was wondering you nationality because of your comment on media. I was just curious.

And I think God would support our fight for liberating a country, not militants who think committing suicide along with killing thousands of innocent people.

And no, I don't think your a traitor. You have the right to your opinion. I just don't see how you can sit and ridicule the slogan "God Bless Our Troops" when it fails to compare with Islamic Jihad. Until the Koran becomes interpreted correctly/differently and Muslims don't belive that killing will get them to Heaven, leave American troops alone.

Kayl

05-13-04, 08:29 PM

Would someone briefly summarise this thread for the benefit of my lazy self?

Andres

05-13-04, 08:32 PM

I fucking loathe and despise any single person in this thread debating with the old "you're anti-american" crock of horseshit. You're the only fucking anti-american inbred pondscum. Being "pro america" isn't being a blind fucking tool who rationalizes the psychological and physical abuse inflicted upon some prisoners as "not bad" because "they aren't innocent", or rationalizing the deaths of hundreds of civilians because "we're still owning iraq". Being "pro-america" is standing for the laws and principles of your country, not for what some war criminals who hold the power do unto others. So how about you cut the "all of your reports just stem from being anti-american, but i'm sooo american i don't care" bullshit and actually start giving a good name to the principles your country stands for, which I assure you are not "to torture rebels into submission and sexually abuse them"?

Kunio

05-13-04, 08:34 PM

SIR, IT'S BECAUSE YOU HAVE THE COMPLETE TWO OPPOSITES ARGUING. This is like a Max Hardcore vs. Jack Chick battle, only not amusing.

KC Vikander

05-13-04, 08:36 PM

Andres, may I ask which post exactly set you off?

Andres

05-13-04, 08:40 PM

X's ridiculous "in denial" posts.

Scatterbrain

05-13-04, 08:43 PM

He's been talking out of his arse through the entire thread...

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 08:49 PM

So then where does it leave us at? We mistreat them a bit, call it torture if you will. And they maul the heads off of our people. If everyone is so quick to label us as mistreating them, I don't see why we don't maul all their heads off and be even with it. Then we can accept the shun of torturing them. [/sarcasm]

MY ... GOD... I think we can all agree that ANY type of torture or abuse is morally wrong. NOBODY deserves to be tortured in any way, shape or form. But that's not the point, the point is.. that it's happening. On both accounts, in both places. True, they are(IRAQ) more brutall than we are (US). But we're still NO BETTER.

You can't put out a fire with more fire. So what can we do? What should we of done a hundred, or even two hundred days ago? Free all the prisoners, pack it up, get the fuck out. And forget about it. Let Iraq stir in their own juices. We've "liberated" them from Sadaam. It's over, our purpous is done there. However, if they are still raw about it. SORRY, deal with it. It's life. It's over, it's done. And if you're still anxious to attack US citizens, then my friends, THEN we shall discuss your real punishment. Thank you and goodnight.

KC Vikander

05-13-04, 08:57 PM

That would be very nice if that would work, but after taking a government out of power, the worst thing we could do is to leave them without any help whatsoever.

Bravoie

05-13-04, 08:58 PM

Originally posted by KC Vikander

There IS a difference between soldiers and civilians. The bottom line is that it is NOT justified for the group of terrorists who killed, totured even, a normal civilian, just because he was an American. That would be just as logical as for me to go and kill a random Arab just to make up for what happened. There is a difference between civilian and soldier.

EXACTLY! If an Iraqi citizen took a trip to America, he wouldn't be captured and beheaded while being taped. As far as the torture pictures go, exactly WHO are these detainees? I understand that they were being interrogated, so who says these people were "innocent civilians"? Like somebody said, it's still under investigation so it's really too early to jump to conclusions.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 08:59 PM

Originally posted by KC Vikander
That would be very nice if that would work, but after taking a government out of power, the worst thing we could do is to leave them without any help whatsoever.

It worked with Cuba... sorta.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 09:03 PM

Andres is a fucking stupid spic.

I'm not calling him anti-American because I disagree with him, it's because he's MAKING STUFF UP.

Yossarko

05-13-04, 09:04 PM

Not as made up as that beheading of the american soldier!!!!

Andres

05-13-04, 09:14 PM

No one's making shit up, you goddamned imbecile. You've seen the pictures, and the reports. FORCED SEX. PSYCHOLOGICAL AND SEXUAL TORTURE. They key word here being torture, exactly what Domke claimed. Torture on innocent civilians. Oh, but they were in prison, they were prisoners, it's cool to torture prisoners. Guess what, Sherlock? 70 to 90 percent of prisoners in Iraq are innocent, or arrested by mistake (http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/story.asp?j=44243689&p=44z4399x). What a danger to society those terrorists are, right? So unless you can show me that physical, psychological, and sexual torture is OK against terrorists, and that of the sample being tortured here, all of them belonged to the 30-10 percent that are actually guilty of something (let alone terrorists), you've got no case. Drop into a pool of acid and die.

Gorosaurus

05-13-04, 09:34 PM

Or you could just be a little more civil with your arguments, all of you.

Maybe then you can actually be respected for your points. It never ceases to amaze me how little additions like slurs and threats sneak their way into these debates. Honestly, hostility does not show confidence in one's stance. I figured this was evident from all intellectual debates OUTSIDE the Internet, bur apparently not.

Kunio

05-13-04, 09:40 PM

So far I found one serious discussion (http://boards.pyoko.org/index.php?showforum=7) board that is amusing without basing their arguments on generalized opinions or insults.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 10:15 PM

Originally posted by Andres De La Hoz
I fucking loathe and despise any single person in this thread debating with the old "you're anti-american" crock of horseshit. You're the only fucking anti-american inbred pondscum. Being "pro america" isn't being a blind fucking tool who rationalizes the psychological and physical abuse inflicted upon some prisoners as "not bad" because "they aren't innocent", or rationalizing the deaths of hundreds of civilians because "we're still owning iraq". Being "pro-america" is standing for the laws and principles of your country, not for what some war criminals who hold the power do unto others. So how about you cut the "all of your reports just stem from being anti-american, but i'm sooo american i don't care" bullshit and actually start giving a good name to the principles your country stands for, which I assure you are not "to torture rebels into submission and sexually abuse them"?

MY MAN ANDRES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU FOR SHOWING UP!

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 10:17 PM

Originally posted by Ramza Brave
So then where does it leave us at? We mistreat them a bit, call it torture if you will. And they maul the heads off of our people. If everyone is so quick to label us as mistreating them, I don't see why we don't maul all their heads off and be even with it. Then we can accept the shun of torturing them. [/sarcasm]

MY ... GOD... I think we can all agree that ANY type of torture or abuse is morally wrong. NOBODY deserves to be tortured in any way, shape or form. But that's not the point, the point is.. that it's happening. On both accounts, in both places. True, they are(IRAQ) more brutall than we are (US). But we're still NO BETTER.

You can't put out a fire with more fire. So what can we do? What should we of done a hundred, or even two hundred days ago? Free all the prisoners, pack it up, get the fuck out. And forget about it. Let Iraq stir in their own juices. We've "liberated" them from Sadaam. It's over, our purpous is done there. However, if they are still raw about it. SORRY, deal with it. It's life. It's over, it's done. And if you're still anxious to attack US citizens, then my friends, THEN we shall discuss your real punishment. Thank you and goodnight.

I serioulsy NEVER thought Ramza and I would ever agree on anything. You put it in such a basic fashion that I can't even compete. Well said, hat's off. Ramza, tell me something, do you think it's an oil thing? In which case, they ain't leavin, Saddam or no Saddam.

Andres

05-13-04, 10:27 PM

Originally posted by Gorosaurus
Or you could just be a little more civil with your arguments, all of you.

Maybe then you can actually be respected for your points. It never ceases to amaze me how little additions like slurs and threats sneak their way into these debates. Honestly, hostility does not show confidence in one's stance. I figured this was evident from all intellectual debates OUTSIDE the Internet, bur apparently not.

or you can ignore that and address the points, which is what we all do.

Gorosaurus

05-13-04, 10:32 PM

Oh, I think I'll ignore more than that.

But of course, that's just because I'm blissfully ignorant.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 10:41 PM

Originally posted by Kunio
So far I found one serious discussion (http://boards.pyoko.org/index.php?showforum=7) board that is amusing without basing their arguments on generalized opinions or insults.

Pardon my French:

THAT IS JUST FUCKING BEAUTIFUL!!!!!!! NOW THEY'RE GOING TO FUCKING DRAFT US BECAUSE THEY DON'T KNOW HOW TO CLEAN THEIR FUCKING MESS UP! FUCK THAT! SEND ME TO JAIL!! I'M NOT GOING TO BE A FUCKING OIL THUG!

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 11:02 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
Yeah, I know that happened, shitface. They still aren't CIVILIANS, and they aren't INNOCENT.

So when did Americans 'torture, rape and kill innocent Iraqi civillians'? I'm still wondering about this...

Actually, the Brigadier-General in charge of Abu Ghraib has admitted that roughly 90% of the prisoners there were falsely arrested, and most likely are just civilians who got caught up in some fighting and mistaken for soldiers. She says there is no evidence to suggest that they were ever Iraqi soldiers or even militiamen.

Ramza Brave

05-13-04, 11:03 PM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper

I serioulsy NEVER thought Ramza and I would ever agree on anything. You put it in such a basic fashion that I can't even compete. Well said, hat's off. Ramza, tell me something, do you think it's an oil thing? In which case, they ain't leavin, Saddam or no Saddam.

No doubt about that one. It's not even a question anymore. Whatever this country stood for in good name, has been lost. All that's left is a sour taste in the back of our throats. The result of us being capitalistic now leaves us completely RUN by these massive tyrants. Speaking of the oil companies in general, every president who's ever NOT supported them has been shot. Someone mentioned this a year ago in another thread.

Maybe when the next term comes up and we have a new president we can invade the oil companies and liberate them.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 11:06 PM

Originally posted by Gorosaurus
Oh, I think I'll ignore more than that.
har har, this is all I'm seeing from him:

"This person is on your Ignore List."

Xclexski

05-13-04, 11:09 PM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
Pardon my French:

THAT IS JUST FUCKING BEAUTIFUL!!!!!!! NOW THEY'RE GOING TO FUCKING DRAFT US BECAUSE THEY DON'T KNOW HOW TO CLEAN THEIR FUCKING MESS UP! FUCK THAT! SEND ME TO JAIL!! I'M NOT GOING TO BE A FUCKING OIL THUG! You're a fool if you seriously think there's going to be a draft.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 11:09 PM

Originally posted by Andres De La Hoz
Torture on innocent civilians. Oh, but they were in prison, they were prisoners, it's cool to torture prisoners. Guess what, Sherlock? 70 to 90 percent of prisoners in Iraq are innocent, or arrested by mistake (http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/story.asp?j=44243689&p=44z4399x). What a danger to society those terrorists are, right?

Exactly what I was saying in my last post. The only one making shit up in this topic is Xclexski.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by Mark Veldhuizen
Not as made up as that beheading of the american soldier!!!!
WTF is this. I was just skimming through and must have missed this before. Is this supposed to be 'comedy' or something?

Demented Ferret

05-13-04, 11:14 PM

No, but THIS IS:

Posts the animated decapitation gif along with the benny hill theme but uploader is shit

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 11:17 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
WTF is this. I was just skimming through and must have missed this before. Is this supposed to be 'comedy' or something?

I don't know, it looks sarcastic. Maybe he's referring to the fact that somebody earlier in the thread accidentally said that Nick Berg was an "American soldier"? I dunno.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 11:24 PM

Originally posted by Cal Flavell
Actually, the Brigadier-General in charge of Abu Ghraib has admitted that roughly 90% of the prisoners there were falsely arrested, and most likely are just civilians who got caught up in some fighting and mistaken for soldiers. She says there is no evidence to suggest that they were ever Iraqi soldiers or even militiamen. K, whatever. Maybe it's true and maybe not. I'll let the investigators pass judgement.

I'm just fucking pissed off that terrorists are coming into Iraq with the intent of killing civilians (Americans and Iraqis), and people can compare it to the American forces in general just because of the actions of a few disgruntled prision guards.

Jason Ruiz

05-13-04, 11:28 PM

http://www.disasturbation.com/dubya.wav

Demented Ferret

05-13-04, 11:30 PM

Hahahaha...

Jason Ruiz

05-13-04, 11:31 PM

http://disasturbation.com/dubya2.wav

Demented Ferret

05-13-04, 11:34 PM

Originally posted by Demented Ferret
Hahahaha...

Also, I think it's obvious that you just switch on Sound Recorder without knowing what the hell you're gonna do and just FUCKING ADLIB that shit all the way.

Cal Flavell

05-13-04, 11:35 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
I'm just fucking pissed off that terrorists are coming into Iraq with the intent of killing civilians (Americans and Iraqis), and people can compare it to the American forces in general just because of the actions of a few disgruntled prision guards.

Well, a Red Cross investigation into Abu Ghraib found that it wasn't just a few disgruntled guards... it was an organised system of abuse ordered by a group of higher-ups (two generals, Gen Sanchez and I think a guy named Gen Miller ordered most of it at Abu Ghraib, and some CIA interrogators were apparently enforcing a lot of it). Even Lynndie England (the "leash" chick) said she was just doing what her bosses told her to do... a group of government men apparently asked guards to "pose" for photos showing them abusing and torturing prisoners.

And man, there are unreleased photos of stuff like American soldiers raping Iraqi women, Abu Ghraib guards (Iraqis hired by the American soldiers) raping young boys, of Americans sodomising detainees with broom handles and light sticks, of Americans setting dogs onto helpless naked men... of Americans forcing detainees to masturbate in front of other detainees, or to masturbate other detainees, and female prisoners being forced to have sex with male detainees, all of which is totally against their religion, despite the Geneva convention saying that prisoners have to be treated fairly and their religion has to be respected. Also, there have been twenty confirmed murders of prisoners at Abu Ghraib - and apparently only two of those prisoners were trying to escape. The others just got beaten to death or shot by interrogators for no reason. One of the interrogators was a fucking civilian hired by the CIA, and he's been arrested. A few other soldiers have been court-marshalled (one of whom shot an innocent Iraqi woman in the head in front of a bunch of other Americans, apparently).

Dude, don't just swallow up Bush's words. You're smarter than that.

I think we're lucky to get a pretty broad media here. Our newspapers have both left and right wing editorials, and the articles themselves don't really take any biased stances. It's funny, our prime minister (spineless weakling that he is) told Bush that Australia was all for his coalition, despite concensus polls before the Iraq war showing that 74% of Australian citizens were against it.

Also, X, don't forget that the reason Nick Berg was decapitated was because the Iraqis found out about this stuff. If Americans had never tortured those men, Nick Berg would still be alive. The vast majority of foreign civilians kidnapped in Iraq have been released alive, including Americans, and without an event such as the abuse scandal to spur murder, the Iraqis probably wouldn't have killed Berg. Like when they caught those three Japanese people last month. They were like "we'll kill them unless Japan pulls out of Iraq" and Japan was just like "nope". And the next day the Japanese hostages were released alive anyway.

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 11:38 PM

Originally posted by Xclexski
You're a fool if you seriously think there's going to be a draft.

There's legislation on the floor for it as we speak. To be implemented in Spring of 2005. That's right around when George Bush would be starting a second term. This election just got personal for me.

http://www.fosters.com/May2004/may_09/News/sun_0509d.asp

Read that and try to keep your hair from falling out. I took an oath as a Salvation Army soldier to attempt to lead people to the grace of God through acts of kindness and mercy. Killing them or wounding them is not kind nor merciful. I'll not relinquish the oath I care about in exchange for a lesser one. George Bush isn't God.

Jason Ruiz

05-13-04, 11:40 PM

http://disasturbation.com/dubya3.wav

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 11:43 PM

Originally posted by Fester Freelance
http://disasturbation.com/dubya2.wav

You're right about everything except the part about him going to war just because George Sr. was threatened. These people don't give a crap about anyone but themselves. They eat their young. IT WAS OIL and I WILL NOT KILL OR DIE FOR IT!

God save us.

Jason Ruiz

05-13-04, 11:44 PM

http://www.disasturbation.com/dubya4.wav

Damien Jasper

05-13-04, 11:47 PM

You should get a radio show, cheif.

Actually I think I know why you laughed. It's because the idea of anyone actually voting for Al Sharpton is so funny.

Xclexski

05-13-04, 11:54 PM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
There's legislation on the floor for it as we speak. To be implemented in Spring of 2005. That's right around when George Bush would be starting a second term. This election just got personal for me.Bleh, believe it if you want. Doesn't bother me. I'll be enlisted in the Marine Corps before then.

Xclexski

05-14-04, 12:16 AM

Originally posted by Cal Flavell
Also, X, don't forget that the reason Nick Berg was decapitated was because the Iraqis found out about this stuff. If Americans had never tortured those men, Nick Berg would still be alive. The vast majority of foreign civilians kidnapped in Iraq have been released alive, including Americans, and without an event such as the abuse scandal to spur murder, the Iraqis probably wouldn't have killed Berg. Like when they caught those three Japanese people last month. They were like "we'll kill them unless Japan pulls out of Iraq" and Japan was just like "nope". And the next day the Japanese hostages were released alive anyway. I disagree. The guys who killed him are fucking maniacs. They came out to Iraq just because they would have the chance to kill Americans. It can't be said that they cut his head off just because of the abuse. You can't follow the logic of religious fanatics. These guys are just fucking unpredictable. I'm sure it was in retaliation, but that still doesn't justify it.

I don't think the abuse pictures should have been made public. I think it's total bullshit what happened to the prisioners, but the general public doesn't need to see it, at least until the whole situation it over. It just turns into a big shitty mess like this. People are using the pictures for propaganda and political purposes all over the world. The people involved need to be prosecuted and removed quietly, without distracting people from the big picture.

It also sucks about all the media attention around Nick Berg. People need to be informed about these things, but it just sucks for his family because they didn't want it to get as huge as it is.

Orcus

05-14-04, 12:26 AM

What I don't get is that ok the prison guards did all that shit to the prisoners, that was just wrong so now the US government is taking it into their own hands and punishing the guards like they should. There really was no point for this retaliation by Al Queda since it wasn't like we were just ignoring the torturing of the prisoners we were actually taking action and hopefully giving those guards what they deserve. But hey what do I know I'm just a 17 year old American that'll prolly soon get thrown into all this shit.

Andres

05-14-04, 12:28 AM

(at X)
In other words, we shouldn't be able to see the repercusions or negative aspects of the invasion in fear of offending people.

Tell that to the dead iraquis.

Damien Jasper

05-14-04, 12:30 AM

Originally posted by Orcus
What I don't get is that ok the prison guards did all that shit to the prisoners, that was just wrong so now the US government is taking it into their own hands and punishing the guards like they should. There really was no point for this retaliation by Al Queda since it wasn't like we were just ignoring the torturing of the prisoners we were actually taking action and hopefully giving those guards what they deserve. But hey what do I know I'm just a 17 year old American that'll prolly soon get thrown into all this shit.

No shit. Remember folks, the Draft is coming Spring '05.

Damage Jackal

05-14-04, 12:31 AM

Originally posted by Xclexski
That never fucking happened. It's not torture, idiot.

Abuse? Yes. Those guys were assholes, and what they did was probably unnecessary, but they aren't going around CUTTING HEADS OFF. uh, dude, your logic is pretty flawed here. cutting someone's head off isn't necessarily torture. murder, yes, torture, no. torture is being stripped naked and having savage dogs set on you. or being sodomised with a broom.
Originally posted by Xclexski
If there was 'torture, rape and kill innocent Iraqi civillians' by Americans, I think everyone would know about it. The media would have a field day.uh, dude, i dunno which 'media' you're talking about, but down here the media is having a field day.
Originally posted by shagz2dope
If an Iraqi citizen took a trip to America, he wouldn't be captured and beheaded while being taped.yeah. the americans would be too busy tieing gay guys to wooden poles and beating them to death while police officers beat the shit out of black guys.
Originally posted by Cal Flavell
I think we're lucky to get a pretty broad media here. Our newspapers have both left and right wing editorials, and the articles themselves don't really take any biased stances.clearly you don't read the herald sun much...
that said, though, the overall balance of the media here is pretty impressive, i agree. we have both right and left leaning media outlets.

Damien Jasper

05-14-04, 12:39 AM

Here's hoping for the success of the Liberal Radio Network even though I can't stand Gerafelo. (sp?)

Skitch

05-14-04, 12:42 AM

There have been a lot of good points made in this thread, but i'll say this;

I've listened/read lots of debating about the war and one thing that really pisses me off is how people are always defending stereo-typing Iraqis, saying "kill them all...ect" and people say "thats stereo-typing", BUT..then they see/hear about the torturing of Iraqi prisoners and all of the sudden the ENTIRE american army are the badguys.

NO, we have fucking sickos in that prison that did completely wrong and immoral things and SHOULD be punished BUT that doesn't meen all US forces are exactly the same as those men/women. I don't believe for ONE second that people higher in command gave the orders to those sicko prison guards, thats bullshit.

Don't get me wrong, im not saying that I stereo-type Iraqi people, they are just as normal as us and in no way terrorists. But im saying NICE FUCKING double standard guys.

Just because of those idiots mistakes doesn't meen all our forces are like that, I know a lot of good men over in Iraq.

I hope I made some sort of sense in that post?

Jaymond

05-14-04, 12:43 AM

okay, i'm commenting, (jasper, you have your wish ;)).

i want to comment on a few things, cal said that the CIA hired iraqi civilians to act as detainee interrogators, then as some of these iraqi civilians commited inhumane crimes against the Geneva convention, they were conveniently arrested.

first of all, that sounds like to me, the commanders in control of that division of the U.S. army purposefully hired the iraqi's to weed out their own people. if that got to an even broader extent, it would seriously sound like a self-holocaust plan to me. which is sickening.

on the other hand, this was all just the decision of a few commanders in particular divisions as i said. not one of the U.S. Army as a whole. certainly not what Bush had in mind. but i still don't like him and wish Bill Clinton was back in office. because he's an awesome mother fucker.

secondly, xclexski, you're a funny guy. but you have to know you were grossly uninformed when you denied that there was any raping, torture or execution of 'innocent iraqi civilians' during this whole U.S. tour. simply, domke was right, and you were wrong. and you didn't have to drag racial and immoral slurs in there to try and bring attention to your point. you american pig dog. (LOL SRCASM)

whoever said this was all a part of cause and effect was right. but then it comes down to determining what came first:

the extremist foreign chicken? or the abrasive over-patriotic western egg.

thank you.

Digital Taco

05-14-04, 12:47 AM

SO IN CONCLUSION, BILL BRASKY IS A SON OF A BITCH.

Jaymond

05-14-04, 12:48 AM

pretty much ye-I DON'T KNOW ANY BILL BRASKY BUT LOL GOOD QUOTE THOUGH BECAUSE I KNOW YOU'RE QUOTING A SHOW

Damage Jackal

05-14-04, 12:48 AM

Originally posted by Jaymond
first of all, that sounds like to me, the commanders in control of that division of the U.S. army purposefully hired the iraqi's to weed out their own people. that kind of thing is rampant in times of war. lots of concentration camp d00dz in WWII were inamtes appointed by the nazis.

Originally posted by Jaymond
it comes down to determining what came first:

the extremist foreign chicken? or the abrasive over-patriotic western egg. probably the extremist chicken. there have been religious extremists for as long as there's been religion.

Jaymond

05-14-04, 12:50 AM

Originally posted by Damage Jackal
that kind of thing is rampant in times of war. lots of concentration camp d00dz in WWII were inamtes appointed by the nazis.

EXACTLY AND LOOK WHAT HAPPENED THERE.
your point leads up to my point about basically hiring a culture to execute themselves. yeah

Damien Jasper

05-14-04, 12:52 AM

Hey Jay! Thanks for showing up! It's about time you joined this party!

Anyone else have any thoughts about the draft link I posted?

http://www.fosters.com/May2004/may_09/News/sun_0509d.asp

Damage Jackal

05-14-04, 12:53 AM

to jay:

i know, and it's fucked up. but, what are they gonna do, say no?

Jaymond

05-14-04, 12:56 AM

yep. that subject comes down to that, they can't really fight back, and the ones who do take it too far.

that draft thing damien sounds pretty bad for the future of our society. if australia still follows under the american principles which we're doing now, i swear to all gods they better not bring conscription back.

it shouldn't turn into another world war type event even though it's situated in one country. honestly, 3dmm community: would anyone of you go out to fight for your country over this war and over these principles? tell me who would. and why.

Digital Taco

05-14-04, 12:59 AM

we're not in it cuz Chrétien is cool

Damien Jasper

05-14-04, 01:04 AM

I wouldn't do it on two principles:

1) My Salvationist Oath which I covered already. Why should the military oath automatically take precedence over the oath I truly care about? What makes it mean so much more?

2) Because the whole thing is a great big crock of bubbling shit anyway. (pardon my French). There ain't no WMDs and I'm not any free-er than I was 2 years ago. It's oil and I won't kill or endanger myself and others for a resource that's gonna run out soon anyway.

Damien Jasper

05-14-04, 01:23 AM

bump.

Xclexski

05-14-04, 01:35 AM

I would go if needed. My reasons:

I believe we need stay until a stable government is set up. It would have been easy to leave after crushing Saddam's army, but that doesn't mean it would have been good. There's no way to back out now, no matter what you think about the war.

There are terrorists there that need to be killed. Simple as that. They want to kill Americans, and any Iraqis or others that aren't part of them.

Skitch

05-14-04, 01:51 AM

Originally posted by Damien Jasper
It's oil and I won't kill or endanger myself and others for a resource that's gonna run out soon anyway.

Yes, because.....well, you know....thats what this entire war is about.

Damien Jasper

05-14-04, 01:53 AM

Yes, that is what it's all about. "Simple as that"

Ramza Brave

05-14-04, 01:55 AM

Thats why we can all agree. The first fusion generator should be ignited in Bush's CRUSTY POO HOLE!

Damien Jasper

05-14-04, 01:55 AM

I think Skitch is being sarcastic with me, chief.

Cal Flavell

05-14-04, 02:48 AM

Originally posted by Jaymond
okay, i'm commenting, (jasper, you have your wish ;)).

i want to comment on a few things, cal said that the CIA hired iraqi civilians to act as detainee interrogators, then as some of these iraqi civilians commited inhumane crimes against the Geneva convention, they were conveniently arrested.

first of all, that sounds like to me, the commanders in control of that division of the U.S. army purposefully hired the iraqi's to weed out their own people. if that got to an even broader extent, it would seriously sound like a self-holocaust plan to me. which is sickening.

No, I said they hired Iraqi guards, who ended up raping boys. I said they hired American interrogators, one of whom killed an Iraqi for no reason and then got incarcerated.